2017 Attendance Thread

[mgarbowski]

I agree about the YS food being an issue, but I think the main cause of Yankee attendance figures is they've been boring for 2-3 years. They managed not to be terrible while they rebuilt, but they were completely boring. And most people have been caught by surprise by their success this year. I think the consensus was this would be a fun year where they get a bit better and play a lot of kids who have potential but fall short. I bet their ST sales lagged for this reason which as we know starts them off from a poor base even if their day to day sales pick up.. And as good as they've done this season it's one month out of six: it's the kind of bandwagon you jump on but stay poised to jump right off. First thing to improve will likely be an uptick in their TV ratings which requires the least commitment. If they continue winning, then the single game sales will increase, and then if they get to July and people still think they'll make the playoffs, they will buy packages to get playoff priority. And they will consider buying ST and packages for next year to get on the ground floor.

Anecdote: a colleague had a Yankee ticket plan a few years ago and dropped it. He went to the game Saturday and was called in advance by a rep who asked if he could stop by and chat to talk about getting a plan again. My friend said yes, and the rep never followed through.

 

[The Toe]

I do think that some of the chicken tendies are among the best I have had, but I get the food issue. However, 12.50 for a beer is just ridiculous. Even at a stadium, that's an absurd markup for mostly "commercial" beer. I'm considering stopping drinking at the stadium because it is essentially 50 bucks for two trips. The amount of WONDERFUL beer you can drink for $50 at home is astounding compared to what it gets you in crap at YS.

 

[Kjbert]

It's not a Yankee thing, it's a baseball thing. Baseball is boring. Most live sports are boring now. Hockey is fun. Soccer is fun. Basketball can be fun. And you know how long the games will last.

Baseball has a time problem. There are just too many competing forces for eyeballs

 

[Gotham Gator]

I agree about the YS food being an issue, but I think the main cause of Yankee attendance figures is they've been boring for 2-3 years. They managed not to be terrible while they rebuilt, but they were completely boring. And most people have been caught by surprise by their success this year. I think the consensus was this would be a fun year where they get a bit better and play a lot of kids who have potential but fall short. I bet their ST sales lagged for this reason which as we know starts them off from a poor base even if their day to day sales pick up.. And as good as they've done this season it's one month out of six: it's the kind of bandwagon you jump on but stay poised to jump right off. First thing to improve will likely be an uptick in their TV ratings which requires the least commitment. If they continue winning, then the single game sales will increase, and then if they get to July and people still think they'll make the playoffs, they will buy packages to get playoff priority. And they will consider buying ST and packages for next year to get on the ground floor.

Anecdote: a colleague had a Yankee ticket plan a few years ago and dropped it. He went to the game Saturday and was called in advance by a rep who asked if he could stop by and chat to talk about getting a plan again. My friend said yes, and the rep never followed through.

I think there is a lot to what you say, but it doesn't explain everything.

Certainly, they have been boring. Last season, I spoke to a friend who is a big fan. I asked her if there were a single player on the team you would be excited to see in person. She said there was nobody. Without guys like Jeter or ARod (in his prime) or Rivera, it just isn't exciting to go to the Stadium.

I do think that's changing this year. Aaron Judge has been as exciting as they get, and Chapman is a lot of fun to watch.

Still, it's worth noting that attendance has been declining steadily for the Yankees for 6 of the last 7 seasons, and has dropped 23.5% since 2010. Now, 16.3% has been since 2014, which was a little after they started missing the playoffs, but the trend does extend back to when they were making the ALCS.

There is more going on. Some of it is the decline of baseball; some the decline of in house attendance for sports generally; some the relatively poor experience of Yankee Stadium (food included); some the high cost of going.

If they continue to play well, and this doesn't get flipped around - especially after they poured money into the venue to make it more fan friendly - it really is panic mode.

ETA: 2014 was the only year since 2010 when attendance climbed. That was Derek Jeter's last year.

 

[Ulrich]

I think there is a lot to what you say, but it doesn't explain everything.

Certainly, they have been boring. Last season, I spoke to a friend who is a big fan. I asked her if there were a single player on the team you would be excited to see in person. She said there was nobody. Without guys like Jeter or ARod (in his prime) or Rivera, it just isn't exciting to go to the Stadium.

I do think that's changing this year. Aaron Judge has been as exciting as they get, and Chapman is a lot of fun to watch.

Still, it's worth noting that attendance has been declining steadily for the Yankees for 6 of the last 7 seasons, and has dropped 23.5% since 2010. Now, 16.3% has been since 2014, which was a little after they started missing the playoffs, but the trend does extend back to when they were making the ALCS.

There is more going on. Some of it is the decline of baseball; some the decline of in house attendance for sports generally; some the relatively poor experience of Yankee Stadium (food included); some the high cost of going.

If they continue to play well, and this doesn't get flipped around - especially after they poured money into the venue to make it more fan friendly - it really is panic mode.

ETA: 2014 was the only year since 2010 when attendance climbed. That was Derek Jeter's last year.

I'd also add that Yankee stadium is not as nice as Citi Field - I find CF to be much more enjoyable of a venue (although transit to is a whole different story). For the amount of money the Yankees spent building the venue, I personally don't think they achieved greatness.

 

[SoupInNYC]

I think there is a lot to what you say, but it doesn't explain everything.

Certainly, they have been boring. Last season, I spoke to a friend who is a big fan. I asked her if there were a single player on the team you would be excited to see in person. She said there was nobody. Without guys like Jeter or ARod (in his prime) or Rivera, it just isn't exciting to go to the Stadium.

I do think that's changing this year. Aaron Judge has been as exciting as they get, and Chapman is a lot of fun to watch.

Still, it's worth noting that attendance has been declining steadily for the Yankees for 6 of the last 7 seasons, and has dropped 23.5% since 2010. Now, 16.3% has been since 2014, which was a little after they started missing the playoffs, but the trend does extend back to when they were making the ALCS.

There is more going on. Some of it is the decline of baseball; some the decline of in house attendance for sports generally; some the relatively poor experience of Yankee Stadium (food included); some the high cost of going.

If they continue to play well, and this doesn't get flipped around - especially after they poured money into the venue to make it more fan friendly - it really is panic mode.

ETA: 2014 was the only year since 2010 when attendance climbed. That was Derek Jeter's last year.

I was wondering how much of this may be declining attendance across baseball in general and found the following Forbes article published October of last year with the included chart.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/mauryb...ll-time-down-slightly-from-2015/#19d40fe472ff

Looks like attendance has somewhat been steadily declining since 2007 across the league.

Edited to include notes that that highest point is in 2007, the other "peak" later on is 2012.

 

[Questionable8]

I do think that some of the chicken tendies are among the best I have had, but I get the food issue. However, 12.50 for a beer is just ridiculous. Even at a stadium, that's an absurd markup for mostly "commercial" beer. I'm considering stopping drinking at the stadium because it is essentially 50 bucks for two trips. The amount of WONDERFUL beer you can drink for $50 at home is astounding compared to what it gets you in crap at YS.

pre-game, my friend

 

[mgarbowski]

I was wondering how much of this may be declining attendance across baseball in general and found the following Forbes article published October of last year with the included chart.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/mauryb...ll-time-down-slightly-from-2015/#19d40fe472ff

Looks like attendance has somewhat been steadily declining since 2007 across the league.

Edited to include notes that that highest point is in 2007, the other "peak" later on is 2012.

The big peak correlates with the real estate bubble. There not been a steady decline from 2007 to now. There was a substantial decline from 2007-2009 (bubble popped). Since then it has been flat. The difference between 2009 and 2016 is 300 people per game, also known as noise. Given the economy has recovered, albeit not as much as anyone hoped, and population is increasing, MLB should be disappointed that attendance has not grown since 2009, but it hasn't gone down.
Also note the chart is designed to emphasize small differences by eliminating Y-axis values below 68 million. Revise the Y-axis to show 0-80 million and the line would look almost flat.

 

[NickFromAstoria]

The big peak correlates with the real estate bubble.

Bet a big part of that 2007 bubble was also in anticipation of Barry Bonds breaking Aaron's home run record too.

 

[Seth]

Also note the chart is designed to emphasize small differences by eliminating Y-axis values below 68 million. Revise the Y-axis to show 0-80 million and the line would look almost flat.

 

[mgarbowski]

League attendance report is out.
NYCFC finished with average attendance of 22,177, which was just barely above the league-wide average of 22,106, but also puts the team in sixth place overall. Atlanta at 48k and Seattle at 43k pull the average up but it's kind of misleading. The median is between SJ at 19,875 and Montreal at 20,046.

Teams that beat us were:
Atlanta 48.2k
Seattle 43.7k
Toronto 27.6k
Orlando 25.0k
Galaxy 22.2k

Two relocated Home games suppressed our totals, probably enough to have surpassed the Galaxy, but it happened.

The away record is where I'm scratching my head:
Orlando: 25,572
Red Bulls 25,527
Galaxy 23,936
Toronto 23,273
NYCFC 23,031

The best I can figure is that Orlando played twice in Atlanta and in Seattle, though that's just one extra high attendance compared to many. Toronto had the draw of being in first pretty much all year plus 2 high profile USMNT stars. I can't explain the Red Bulls or LA at all.

 

[Seth]

League attendance report is out.
NYCFC finished with average attendance of 22,177, which was just barely above the league-wide average of 22,106, but also puts the team in sixth place overall. Atlanta at 48k and Seattle at 43k pull the average up but it's kind of misleading. The median is between SJ at 19,875 and Montreal at 20,046.

Teams that beat us were:
Atlanta 48.2k
Seattle 43.7k
Toronto 27.6k
Orlando 25.0k
Galaxy 22.2k

Two relocated Home games suppressed our totals, probably enough to have surpassed Orlando, but it happened.

The away record is where I'm scratching my head:
Orlando: 25,572
Red Bulls 25,527
Galaxy 23,936
Toronto 23,273
NYCFC 23,031

The best I can figure is that Orlando played twice in Atlanta and in Seattle, though that's just one extra high attendance compared to many. Toronto had the draw of being in first pretty much all year plus 2 high profile USMNT stars. I can't explain the Red Bulls or LA at all.

Away attendance is tricky and I've never been a fan of tracking it (not that we shouldn't, of course). The problem is that you don't know if away attendance is due to the attractiveness of the visiting team or if instead it's because they've traveled to a stadium that draws a lot of people regardless of who the visiting team is.

For example, if NJRB plays away in Atlanta twice, say, those attendance numbers might not have anything to do with the fact that it's the Red Bulls but probably have more to do with the fact that it's in Atlanta and those people show up. If it were possible to provide a statistical weight to the numbers based on being above average attendance at that location or below that would be more meaningful. In other words, if average attendance in Atlanta is 50,000 and they reliably get 60,000 when we show up odds are good we're bringing in extra people because it's us. Same for if it's 40,000. That would indicate people are *not* showing up for us.

Raw numbers may only tell a portion of the story.

 

[Kjbert]

What was our average attendance if you take out Connecticut? I think it's fair to leave in Citi Field

 

[LostAnvil]

League attendance report is out.
NYCFC finished with average attendance of 22,177

Going by LionNYC 2017 Guess the Attendance thread - the average attendance is at 22,439 (difference of 262) - hey MLS, I demand a recount!

 

[LostAnvil]

What was our average attendance if you take out Connecticut? I think it's fair to leave in Citi Field

23,206

 

[Gotham Gator]

What was our average attendance if you take out Connecticut? I think it's fair to leave in Citi Field

Somewhat fair. The last game was over 30,000 at Yankee Stadium in each of the first two seasons, so I think we beat 20K pretty handily if the venue hadn't changed.

Best weather for a game all year, and we've had some crap weather.

 

[Seth]

Up to the minute, with Hartford and Citi Field included:

If we have 29,000 for the match on 11/5 the 2017 line is flat, 30,000 or higher and the line trends upward. So not bad considering how much Hartford dragged the average down.

10k at Hartford sucked.

 

[Jon]

Up to the minute, with Hartford and Citi Field included:

If we have 29,000 for the match on 11/5 the 2017 line is flat, 30,000 or higher and the line trends upward. So not bad considering how much Hartford dragged the average down.

10k at Hartford sucked.

Even if you throw out Hartford it's a shame our attendance numbers continue to decline. The team is fun to watch, YS while not a great place to watch a game is easy to get to, and tickets are reasonably priced.

Wish I had a magic answer for bringing more people to games.

 

[mgarbowski]

Even if you throw out Hartford it's a shame our attendance numbers continue to decline. The team is fun to watch, YS while not a great place to watch a game is easy to get to, and tickets are reasonably priced.

Wish I had a magic answer for bringing more people to games.

Looking at the graph, it seems the to be mostly a matter of decreased attendance for event games. In 2015 the First Historic Home Opener and First Historic Red Bull Derby really skewed the average up, and nothing in 2016 or 2017 come close. Note that only 5 games in 2015 were at or above average for the year. Those 2, Pirlo's first game, the last game, and a seeming random game against Columbus in late August.
In 2016 the home opener was no longer historic, the 2 derbies drew well, as did the Galaxy game when a bunch of people came out for Gerrard, but they were much less less than the big games in 2015. Meanwhile the average attendance of all the other games -- just by eyeballing it -- seems pretty much the same as 2015. Now in 2017, the big event games were fewer: just one derby, a ho-hum home opener, and no special events of other kinds. Then the fiasco of 10k in Hartford and a 20k in Citi that I think was very impressive, but drags behind prior season closers. Adjust for that, and again my eyeball test says the rest of the games are pretty close.

I think the story is that for mundane games there has not been a dropoff, but there has been less buzz and attendance for the buzz games. I also think that's less of a problem. It would be much worse if the opposite were true.

 

[adam]

Wish I had a magic answer for bringing more people to games.

Move us to queens