2017 Season Tactics Thread

Midas Mulligan

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Maybe we can consolidate some of the over-arching tactical discussions.

Here's a decent summary of exactly what many of us are noticing:
http://www.sbnation.com/soccer/2017...red-bulls-atlanta-chicago-fire-timbers-dynamo

Andrea Pirlo isn’t bad. He just doesn’t fit.
Since he’s arrived in MLS, Andrea Pirlo has caught a lot of criticism for being really bad on defense. And honestly, this isn’t his fault. He’s still an extremely useful player if you limit situations where he might get isolated in space.

NYCFC isn’t doing this at all. They’re playing with an extremely high press and asking Pirlo to do a ton of work. And there’s a lot of reason to believe that they’re better off changing their DM than changing the system to fit Pirlo.

Here’s a moment in the first half of NYCFC’s match against Montreal where their two central players ahead of Pirlo — Maxi Moralez and Alexander Ring — pressure aggressively. Moralez’s excellent pressing forces Impact fullback Chris Duvall to make a risky pass to Calum Mallace, which results in a turnover. Ring closes down this space in less than two seconds and sets up what becomes a clear-cut chance.

Screen_Shot_2017_03_20_at_12.21.16_AM.png

But what happens when NYC doesn’t close down the space fast enough? Pirlo gets hung out to dry. In the second half, Moralez and Ring weren’t moving quite as quickly, giving Montreal chances to attack the center of the pitch with long balls that beat Pirlo.

pirlo.png

It would be unfair to say that any of Ring, Moralez or Pirlo is playing poorly. They just fit different systems. If Patrick Vieira is committed to a very aggressive five-man high press — and on the evidence of the 14 shots inside of the box his team created against Montreal, he should be — he needs an athletic DM who can cover a lot of space quickly. Otherwise, NYCFC is going to keep drawing games where they were the superior team.
 
I'd love to see a game with Herrera in for Pirlo, just for verification of the argument above.

That preseason lineup was amazing. Herrera was a solid CDM. Ring was box to box. Maxi floated around.

When he's match fit, I'd like to see Camargo get some minutes too. I think he's more Ring that Herrera though as he went forward a lot.
 
That preseason lineup was amazing. Herrera was a solid CDM. Ring was box to box. Maxi floated around.

When he's match fit, I'd like to see Camargo get some minutes too. I think he's more Ring that Herrera though as he went forward a lot.

I wonder what's up with Camargo. He had a preseason injury, is he not fit yet? Does he look bad in training? I missed his preseason appearance, but others gave a good review.

I thought he would be used as a utility guy across LW, CAM, and RW, but seems like McNamara and even Shelton are above him on the depth chart right now.
 
I'd love to see a game with Herrera in for Pirlo, just for verification of the argument above.

I wonder if that's the plan for 2018? I think Herrera is here for 1.5 - 2 seasons no matter what.

Then the question becomes, where do they look to reinvest the Pirlo DP slot? Maybe in a defender
 
I wonder what's up with Camargo. He had a preseason injury, is he not fit yet? Does he look bad in training? I missed his preseason appearance, but others gave a good review.

I thought he would be used as a utility guy across LW, CAM, and RW, but seems like McNamara and even Shelton are above him on the depth chart right now.
Which makes no sense based on what we've seen. He might be #mixed.
 
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I wonder if that's the plan for 2018? I think Herrera is here for 1.5 - 2 seasons no matter what.

Then the question becomes, where do they look to reinvest the Pirlo DP slot? Maybe in a defender
Don't go into DP talk. There are 8 other threads. This is for THE TACTCIS.

(I admit it's not fully separate, as my first post indicates)
 
We are first in possession and first in passing success, plus first in shots per game in the penalty area. All extremely impressive.

But where are our holes? If you were the opposing manager, how would you "figure us out?"

Our attacks come heavily down the left side (45%). I would shut down that side and make White (who's been surprising excellent but hasn't been asked to do too much) help start more attacks. I would also attack at Matarrita, but with Wallace always capable of tracking back and Callens speed to close down on the outside, I'm not sure that corner is *that* much of a liability.

Ring has been viscious in the middle at breaking up attacks with 4.8 tackles per game (Callens and Chanot at just 1.5 and 1.3 per game, respectively, probably because Ring, Maxi (3.0), Mata (3.3), and White (3.0) are doing an excellent job shielding them.

So do you also attack at White?

I guess the point of my whole post is (1) recognition of White's performance to date and (2) fear that he hasn't been challenged enough yet. Someone will.
 
We are first in possession and first in passing success, plus first in shots per game in the penalty area. All extremely impressive.

But where are our holes? If you were the opposing manager, how would you "figure us out?"

Our attacks come heavily down the left side (45%). I would shut down that side and make White (who's been surprising excellent but hasn't been asked to do too much) help start more attacks. I would also attack at Matarrita, but with Wallace always capable of tracking back and Callens speed to close down on the outside, I'm not sure that corner is *that* much of a liability.

Ring has been viscious in the middle at breaking up attacks with 4.8 tackles per game (Callens and Chanot at just 1.5 and 1.3 per game, respectively, probably because Ring, Maxi (3.0), Mata (3.3), and White (3.0) are doing an excellent job shielding them.

So do you also attack at White?

I guess the point of my whole post is (1) recognition of White's performance to date and (2) fear that he hasn't been challenged enough yet. Someone will.

Hey, you know that other MLS team interns probably read the forum too. Let's not give them something to report to their head coaches about!
 
We are first in possession and first in passing success, plus first in shots per game in the penalty area. All extremely impressive.

But where are our holes? If you were the opposing manager, how would you "figure us out?"

Our attacks come heavily down the left side (45%). I would shut down that side and make White (who's been surprising excellent but hasn't been asked to do too much) help start more attacks. I would also attack at Matarrita, but with Wallace always capable of tracking back and Callens speed to close down on the outside, I'm not sure that corner is *that* much of a liability.

Ring has been viscious in the middle at breaking up attacks with 4.8 tackles per game (Callens and Chanot at just 1.5 and 1.3 per game, respectively, probably because Ring, Maxi (3.0), Mata (3.3), and White (3.0) are doing an excellent job shielding them.

So do you also attack at White?

I guess the point of my whole post is (1) recognition of White's performance to date and (2) fear that he hasn't been challenged enough yet. Someone will.


Fantastic post. I've said this before, but I don't think it is an accident we attack down the left hand side. we essentially morph into a back 3 on the attack. This is why White is playing RB and not Allen. We've chosen this as a strategy. Villa also drifts left and Wallace and Matarrita link up together well.
 
Fantastic post. I've said this before, but I don't think it is an accident we attack down the left hand side. we essentially morph into a back 3 on the attack. This is why White is playing RB and not Allen. We've chosen this as a strategy. Villa also drifts left and Wallace and Matarrita link up together well.

And while it's working so far, is it too one-dimensional to be a season-long tactic?
 
I would suspect that if those were the tactics, we would see it on the average positional map. But we don't. Mata and White are about equal in positioning up the pitch. And Wallace doesnt seem to track back as much as you think. Harrison does though.

upload_2017-4-3_13-19-27.png

upload_2017-4-3_13-20-33.png
Thats San Jose on top, Montreal on bottom.
 
And while it's working so far, is it too one-dimensional to be a season-long tactic?
I think that with Maxi, Ring, and Harrison, the team is able to shift play (through the midfield) to the RW - so if the left is shut down, we have another avenue.
 
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I would suspect that if those were the tactics, we would see it on the average positional map. But we don't. Mata and White are about equal in positioning up the pitch. And Wallace doesnt seem to track back as much as you think. Harrison does though.

View attachment 6835

View attachment 6836
Thats San Jose on top, Montreal on bottom.


Question though - and I don't know how these things work - if Matarrita covers endline to endline, and White only plays from the 18 to the midfield line, would the average positioning map look the same?
 
Question though - and I don't know how these things work - if Matarrita covers endline to endline, and White only plays from the 18 to the midfield line, would the average positioning map look the same?
White makes at least three overlapping runs each game, so his heat map does get extended. Athletically, he's a huge upgrade over Hernandez - his biggest flaw is positional awareness and ball watching, both of which he seems to have worked on to up his game.