What's Lamps per minute played cost now? One of the highest in MLS history.
Salary Cap, MLS Rules And The Future, Oh My!
- Thread starter JGarrettLieb
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Thats great if you dont care. Many others are interested in it.
I personally care for relative comparisons sake. Take Lampard's salary and then look at other players around the league/world and see who else we could have enticed to come to NYCFC for that money. Its opportunity cost, not just cap hit.
It's a bad deal. We know it's several millions. His price per minutes played is going to be astronomic. There is no getting around that. Hopefully Nycfc and CFG learn their lesson.
Yes, there is no getting around it. Does not mean discussing and figuring out what is actual salary is, regardless of the cap impact, is pointless.
Hey guys I updated the list to incorporate the fact that we have gotten rid of some players.
Besides the update I'd like to make a few points.
1. I don't think that we take a salary cap hit for getting rid of Adam Nemec, but looking at the public release of information again I cannot say for sure what mechanism was used to get rid of him. I believe we didn't have to burn our buyout guarantee to free up his cap space, because fuck it I'm being optimistic for once.
1a. I totally called that we were getting rid of Nemec.
1b. Adam Nemec leaving has left us with an unused international spot. We can either sell the spot or fill it. The sense I'm getting is that international spots are something of a buyers market at the moment so its likely that we go for an international player of some sort. Though at the moment we are capped out on players at 28 roster spots filled.
2. LORD KWAME WATSON-SIROBOE will remain with the team. I also called this. But the removal of two more highly paid players from our roster means that LORD KWAME WATSON-SIROBOE's salary now counts against the salary cap. This means that we are likely to either move him, or not care because he is still cheap as all hell. And to be honest while I hope I'm wrong, given LORD KWAME WATSON-SIROBOE's performance, I don't think other teams will take him.
3. I believe that NYCFC will want to make use of their option to completely buy out one player contract this year. The option to buy out a player contract frees up cap space, but at the expense of the club, fortunately we have a wealthy and committed ownership. I believe that CFG will be targeting the use of this option, especially in the first two to four years when we need to keep getting rid of the deadwood that was forced on us by the expansion draft.
3a. Looking at the value players have brought our team versus the amount of money we have paid for them in cap space makes me think that Jeb Brovsky is not long for our team. While you can easily argue that there are worse players on the team, LORD KWAME WATSON-SIROBOE for starters, those players by in large are simply not eating up that much cap space. This adds an interesting twist to MLS vs. European leagues, we can not simply get rid of the worst players, we have to get rid of the worst players by value.
4. This neatly brings us to the problem of Williams, our first player ever to be put on waivers. My reading of this is that, for the moment, Williams still counts against our cap space while on waivers. And by rights should be included in the cap space calculation. But I didn't include him, why? In short while I may not think that Brovsky contributes much to NYCFC, the management thereof thinks that Williams contributes so little he needs to go now. I went back and reread the salary cap rules again, and I can find no mention what so ever about using a contract buyout on a waived player. It's one of MLS's innumerable grey areas. What I suspect is that NYCFC will try to dump Williams on someone else, and if they cannot then NYCFC will buy out his contract so it does not mess with out cap space. Of course I don't actually know if this is allowable, and the only people that do are not talking.
5. I expect one of our roster spaces to be taken up next year by George John. Apparently Jason Kreis is pretty hot on him as a defender and thinks that George John will be one of the best in the league and a national team prospect. http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/artic...kline-not-surprised-how-quickly-it-has-come-t
6. Is the problem of how to actually get George John on our roster and maintain cap space integrity. The long and the short of it is that in 2016 the salary cap increases by $244,300.00 and the fact that Andrea Pirlo will be playing a full year almost entirely eats up that cap space. That assumes that the maximum budget charge for an individual player remains $436,250, which it almost certainly wont. So now we have a player that we've already signed, that we know is good, who can neither pay or play for us ceteris paribus. I believe that we will trade like for like and use our one available contract buyout on Jeb Brovsky. Both players are defenders and honestly, I don't think Brovsky's performance is worth $122k. And while I would dearly love to be rid of LORD KWAME WATSON-SIROBOE I just can't see it working with regard to available cap space.
Notice how I've not talked about Grabavoy yet, I think he somehow keeps his spot on the team due to act of Kreis. And now optimism is balanced with realism.
Besides the update I'd like to make a few points.
1. I don't think that we take a salary cap hit for getting rid of Adam Nemec, but looking at the public release of information again I cannot say for sure what mechanism was used to get rid of him. I believe we didn't have to burn our buyout guarantee to free up his cap space, because fuck it I'm being optimistic for once.
1a. I totally called that we were getting rid of Nemec.
1b. Adam Nemec leaving has left us with an unused international spot. We can either sell the spot or fill it. The sense I'm getting is that international spots are something of a buyers market at the moment so its likely that we go for an international player of some sort. Though at the moment we are capped out on players at 28 roster spots filled.
2. LORD KWAME WATSON-SIROBOE will remain with the team. I also called this. But the removal of two more highly paid players from our roster means that LORD KWAME WATSON-SIROBOE's salary now counts against the salary cap. This means that we are likely to either move him, or not care because he is still cheap as all hell. And to be honest while I hope I'm wrong, given LORD KWAME WATSON-SIROBOE's performance, I don't think other teams will take him.
3. I believe that NYCFC will want to make use of their option to completely buy out one player contract this year. The option to buy out a player contract frees up cap space, but at the expense of the club, fortunately we have a wealthy and committed ownership. I believe that CFG will be targeting the use of this option, especially in the first two to four years when we need to keep getting rid of the deadwood that was forced on us by the expansion draft.
3a. Looking at the value players have brought our team versus the amount of money we have paid for them in cap space makes me think that Jeb Brovsky is not long for our team. While you can easily argue that there are worse players on the team, LORD KWAME WATSON-SIROBOE for starters, those players by in large are simply not eating up that much cap space. This adds an interesting twist to MLS vs. European leagues, we can not simply get rid of the worst players, we have to get rid of the worst players by value.
4. This neatly brings us to the problem of Williams, our first player ever to be put on waivers. My reading of this is that, for the moment, Williams still counts against our cap space while on waivers. And by rights should be included in the cap space calculation. But I didn't include him, why? In short while I may not think that Brovsky contributes much to NYCFC, the management thereof thinks that Williams contributes so little he needs to go now. I went back and reread the salary cap rules again, and I can find no mention what so ever about using a contract buyout on a waived player. It's one of MLS's innumerable grey areas. What I suspect is that NYCFC will try to dump Williams on someone else, and if they cannot then NYCFC will buy out his contract so it does not mess with out cap space. Of course I don't actually know if this is allowable, and the only people that do are not talking.
5. I expect one of our roster spaces to be taken up next year by George John. Apparently Jason Kreis is pretty hot on him as a defender and thinks that George John will be one of the best in the league and a national team prospect. http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/artic...kline-not-surprised-how-quickly-it-has-come-t
6. Is the problem of how to actually get George John on our roster and maintain cap space integrity. The long and the short of it is that in 2016 the salary cap increases by $244,300.00 and the fact that Andrea Pirlo will be playing a full year almost entirely eats up that cap space. That assumes that the maximum budget charge for an individual player remains $436,250, which it almost certainly wont. So now we have a player that we've already signed, that we know is good, who can neither pay or play for us ceteris paribus. I believe that we will trade like for like and use our one available contract buyout on Jeb Brovsky. Both players are defenders and honestly, I don't think Brovsky's performance is worth $122k. And while I would dearly love to be rid of LORD KWAME WATSON-SIROBOE I just can't see it working with regard to available cap space.
Notice how I've not talked about Grabavoy yet, I think he somehow keeps his spot on the team due to act of Kreis. And now optimism is balanced with realism.
Attachments
First off, Williams doesn't count on the books for us. He was placed on waivers and would have counted on our cap however Toronto claimed him off waivers. He is now on their salary cap not ours.
George John's salary is north of $300k. He isn't on the salary cap list due to either being placed on season ending rules and insurance picking it up or another rule we don't know.
Pirlo's salary won't eat up the extra cap space either. His salary would be pro-rated and our salary cap also prorates/adjusts throughout the year as well at any given point. So whether he plays the year or half year the cap implication would be the same.
Josh Williams has been starting for Toronto for the past month. He went from a club where he couldn't get in the lineup to now starting for a club that looks like a lock to make the playoffs.
Edit: I will add that I suspect Williams asked to be released by NYCFC. He wasn't getting playing time once he came back from his health issue and probably wanted to pursue other options. Who knows, maybe NYCFC's medical staff even refused to clear him to play and he thought he was healthy enough. I'd love to know the behind-the-scenes details about this and other situations that occurred this season.
I did not make clear the parts of my post that were targeted towards next season. Nor did I fully do my research with regards to George John's actual salary and Williams current status on Toronto. I apologize for putting together a post that was substandard to my usual quality.
Pirlo's salary on the other hand will eat up additional cap space next year. Pirlo came in halfway through the season, therefore his salary and cap hit are prorated to half of their real full year cost; as stated in the MLS salary rules.
Don't get me started on Lampard, because I genuinely don't know how he screws with our cap. I just assume the pessimist case that he fully impacts the cap.
What running this analysis has done for me is show how freaking good NYCFC is at managing cap space. All else being equal, the team we are going into next year with is either close to or actually compliant with normal MLS allocation money requirements.
Though with George John having a $300k salary we have to start looking at the following people being cut next year,
Diskerud
Wingert
Iraola
Calle
Grabavoy
Mena
Hernandez
Jacobson
The list looks the way it does because those are all of the people NYCFC has on the roster who are not DP's but make $150k or more a year. We need to either get rid of George John or cut one or more of them, otherwise I simply do not see how in g-ds name we are cap space compliant.
Though that is contingent on there not being a big increase in Garber bucks next year. Or Garber could decide that two clubs debuting in the same year lead to a raw deal for both in terms of the drafts/talent, and decides to give both NYCFC and Orlando more Garber bucks because he can.
Here's a list for understanding allocation money:
- an expansion team receives the most, rumored to be around $1 million.
- a club that doesn't make the playoffs gets a larger allocation amount, but not as big as expansion clubs. Rumor is between $250$500k. This is often called the YS Allocation, short for You Suck allocation.
- if you make the playoffs and qualify for CCL you also get an allocation amount. Rumor is $250-$500k.
- if you make the playoffs but don't win or qualify for CCL, your screwed, you get a normal allocation amount. Somewhere south of $250k.
- winning USOC also qualifies you for CCL and you receive a larger allocation.
So it's almost better from a money standpoint for NYCFC to either not make playoffs, or they have to win it.
- an expansion team receives the most, rumored to be around $1 million.
- a club that doesn't make the playoffs gets a larger allocation amount, but not as big as expansion clubs. Rumor is between $250$500k. This is often called the YS Allocation, short for You Suck allocation.
- if you make the playoffs and qualify for CCL you also get an allocation amount. Rumor is $250-$500k.
- if you make the playoffs but don't win or qualify for CCL, your screwed, you get a normal allocation amount. Somewhere south of $250k.
- winning USOC also qualifies you for CCL and you receive a larger allocation.
So it's almost better from a money standpoint for NYCFC to either not make playoffs, or they have to win it.
We've locked up some extra allocation money for not making the playoffs.... Go team!
We're also all but certain to have the 4th pick in the super draft. There is a small chance of us having a better pick if we lose and Colorado gets 3 points in the final 2 games or Philly beats Orlando by a significant amount. Our goal differential +5 of Colorado and +7 of Philly so it is unlikely. Colorado plays KC and then Timbers both @ home so it is more likely that they surpass us in the standings but again very unlikely. Both KC and Portland are fighting for their playoff life. If they lose on Wednesday then goal differential will be at least 6 so that scenario will be over. This works out so we can cheer for the win on Sunday knowing losing doesn't help the franchise in anyway. I hate cheering for losing but in a structure designed where you benefit in losing as the draft does then I understand why some might hope for a loss.
We're also all but certain to have the 4th pick in the super draft. There is a small chance of us having a better pick if we lose and Colorado gets 3 points in the final 2 games or Philly beats Orlando by a significant amount. Our goal differential +5 of Colorado and +7 of Philly so it is unlikely. Colorado plays KC and then Timbers both @ home so it is more likely that they surpass us in the standings but again very unlikely. Both KC and Portland are fighting for their playoff life. If they lose on Wednesday then goal differential will be at least 6 so that scenario will be over. This works out so we can cheer for the win on Sunday knowing losing doesn't help the franchise in anyway. I hate cheering for losing but in a structure designed where you benefit in losing as the draft does then I understand why some might hope for a loss.
Sure there are talents out there like Cyle Larin from time to time, but the SuperDraft isn't what it used to be. I am not sure its ever worth it to tank a season to move up in the draft, this isn't the NFL or NBA.
Certainly not but noteworthy anyway. I've seen people in the past couple weeks suggest that we should tank.
Meaningless update to a meaningless topic I brought up ...Colorado beat SKC 2-0 down a man... (SKC with some serious issues as they're fighting for their playoff lives.) We're now tied in points with Colorado but we still have a +3 goal differential on them going into the final weekend.
So the CBA was released today: http://www.mlsplayers.org/images/Collective Bargaining Agreement - February 1, 2015.pdf
We are wasting our time.
We are wasting our time.
Hilarious, and there's still people claiming the rules are clear/ teams can't get away with anything ? (Within some reason!!! Hope I don't read the foolish Jack Harrison example again)......
But I don't mind the vague rules, when the league grows into a a real Futbol world power- then I'll change my mind.
But I don't mind the vague rules, when the league grows into a a real Futbol world power- then I'll change my mind.
Hey I'm doing an update/new thread for this with the new information that just came out. Is there anyone who understands our current international slot situation, that can help me out a bit with some clarifications?
Also anyone up on any gam or tam we traded for? I didn't watch the trades we made that closely.
Also anyone up on any gam or tam we traded for? I didn't watch the trades we made that closely.
I'm not the right person to ask about specifics but this thread/post might help you start piecing it together
We have 11 slots - 3 above the base rate. We got one slot for 2015 & 2016 from DC for GAM, one from Galaxy for 2015 & 2016 for GAM and one just for 2016 from Sporting KC for TAM. We're using all of them now that Jack isn't disabled any more.
Oof.... Next year is going to be interesting if we lose 3 international spots. Or it'll be interesting if we have to spend gam/tam to keep them which will only hinder our transfer ability.
Mix will either be kept because he's an American or he'll be transferred/traded for Cap space/allocation money.
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