2019 General MLS Transfer Rumors

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mgarbowski

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who has been compensated for letting a manager go? I think only chelsea paid an amount of some sort to porto for AVB but that was probably the only time i ever heard of such a thing. they have clauses but i dont think there are fees attached to managers for leaving.
Multiple examples here:


It is also standard practice in the NFL, MLB and NBA.
 
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SoupInNYC

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It was set to be paid after he was no longer a DP. Can you pay DPs in annuities?
I see what you're saying, but I don't think it should have any effect since Rooney was a DP when he was playing here.

Now, if DCU were to use those annuity payments to lure Rooney in on an under-valued contract that made him a TAM player or something, then I think I would take further issue with that.
 
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SoupInNYC

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I see what you're saying, but I don't think it should have any effect since Rooney was a DP when he was playing here.

Now, if DCU were to use those annuity payments to lure Rooney in on an under-valued contract that made him a TAM player or something, then I think I would take further issue with that.
And now this has me thinking even further about ways to skirt the cap, granted there may be mechanisms MLS has to keep these from happening that we don't quite know about.

For argument's sake, let's take the latest Mertens rumor and say we want him now and Medina is staying as a DP. Mertens wants $3m/year to play here. Offer him a $1m/year contract and buy down with TAM and Etihad Airways just happens to offer him a marketing deal where he appears in one commercial and is paid $2m?
 

Rimil

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And now this has me thinking even further about ways to skirt the cap, granted there may be mechanisms MLS has to keep these from happening that we don't quite know about.

For argument's sake, let's take the latest Mertens rumor and say we want him now and Medina is staying as a DP. Mertens wants $3m/year to play here. Offer him a $1m/year contract and buy down with TAM and Etihad Airways just happens to offer him a marketing deal where he appears in one commercial and is paid $2m?
first rule of collusion, don't put it in writing.... come on man you know this. Back to the drawing board.
 
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Fantazma

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Multiple examples here:


It is also standard practice in the NFL, MLB and NBA.
interesting, thought that all happened within UK, not sure about international moves since there are different laws in different countries and different leagues.. Similar to the MLB, NBA, NFL examples, those are all within league so easier to monitor/ force something out of it. id like to see international movement examples because thats what happened here.

another thing is that there was only 6 months left in PV contract, not sure what can you get for that, if anything, i mean if a player with 6 months left in a contract can negotiate with new team with little to no compensation, then why cant a manager?

Besides we are not getting any GAM/TAM out of manager movements and CFG doesnt even need the money, MLS? they would be benefiting from it i guess, but what good is that for us?
 

Ulrich

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I see what you're saying, but I don't think it should have any effect since Rooney was a DP when he was playing here.

Now, if DCU were to use those annuity payments to lure Rooney in on an under-valued contract that made him a TAM player or something, then I think I would take further issue with that.
He was a DP, but he won’t in the future, and DC will replace him with another DP, so if they’re still paying him owed money then they’re essentially paying an extra DP. That money should either be canceled on exit, paid out on exit, or if continued as an annuity it’s a cap hit against a non-DP (full yearly amount), or they get one less DP on the roster while paying it.

Otherwise, then every team should just backload extremely long contracts so that they can drop players but not be cap-charged since they’re not on the roster (which doesn’t make sense).
 
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mgarbowski

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interesting, thought that all happened within UK, not sure about international moves since there are different laws in different countries and different leagues.. Similar to the MLB, NBA, NFL examples, those are all within league so easier to monitor/ force something out of it. id like to see international movement examples because thats what happened here.

another thing is that there was only 6 months left in PV contract, not sure what can you get for that, if anything, i mean if a player with 6 months left in a contract can negotiate with new team with little to no compensation, then why cant a manager?

Besides we are not getting any GAM/TAM out of manager movements and CFG doesnt even need the money, MLS? they would be benefiting from it i guess, but what good is that for us?
The article clearly explained that the granting of compensation was always based on the language of the contract. It had nothing to do with FA or EPL regulations and so would not be limited to internal UK transfers. The same would be true in America. It is true that US sports leagues often have regulations on this, but if they didn't the system would default to -- again -- the language of the contract. The league regulation act as a one-way ratchet. They can limit what clubs demand as compensation, or the situations where it is allowed, but they cannot expand on what would be allowed under general contract law.

Basic contract law requires mutual enforcement. You cannot have a contract where, e.g., Wayne Rooney can demand DCU pay him to the end of a contract even if he gets injured, but if Rooney wants to leave before the contract ends DCU has no rights in return. Employers can never force an employee to stay and keep working. Among other things, it violates the 13th Amendment to the Constitution in the US. And you can't keep a person from taking a completely unrelated job. If Patrick Viera wanted to quit to become a florist, then NYCFC could never under any circumstances stop him or demand compensation. But when an employee working under a fixed term contract quits to get a new job in the same field, the original employer does have rights. There are limits that vary under law depending on the industry, specific job, and such. If a chef is under contract with a restaurant and wants to leave, her employer can probably stop her from working for or opening a new restaurant in the same neighborhood or city or maybe even a few counties away. But they probably couldn't stop her from doing so in another state in another time zone because there is no meaningful competition between them. But the market for soccer players and coaches is international and fans watch games all over the world and that means that employers will generally have rights internationally. Leaving the country is not a free ticket that allows you to violate contract terms.

Finally, most people do not work under fixed-time-period contracts, so the employer can fire you at any time and you can quit at any time and neither side has much recourse against the other absent something like discrimination or harassment. All of the above only applies when there is an employment contract for a specific period of time.

And to your last question, the point is to simply enforce the principle that though the big and strong get to do what they want they also have to pay a price. It's natural that both players and coaches will want to move from MLS to bigger, more lucrative opportunities. And the league and its clubs should facilitate that. But they should do so without being chumps that just get stepped on at the whim of bigger clubs and massive stars. Rooney had a contract that protected him for a fixed period of time in case he was injured, or if his skills rapidly deteriorated. Vieira had a contract that protected him against the possibility that NYCFC became unhappy with his performance and wanted to can him. Both could demand to be paid until the contract ended no matter almost anything. The price for that is you cannot leave for a better similar job without offering something back in return besides not being paid after you quit.
 
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Fantazma

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The article clearly explained that the granting of compensation was always based on the language of the contract. It had nothing to do with FA or EPL regulations and so would not be limited to internal UK transfers. The same would be true in America. It is true that US sports leagues often have regulations on this, but if they didn't the system would default to -- again -- the language of the contract. The league regulation act as a one-way ratchet. They can limit what clubs demand as compensation, or the situations where it is allowed, but they cannot expand on what would be allowed under general contract law.

Basic contract law requires mutual enforcement. You cannot have a contract where, e.g., Wayne Rooney can demand DCU pay him to the end of a contract even if he gets injured, but if Rooney wants to leave before the contract ends DCU has no rights in return. Employers can never force an employee to stay and keep working. Among other things, it violates the 13th Amendment to the Constitution in the US. And you can't keep a person from taking a completely unrelated job. If Patrick Viera wanted to quit to become a florist, then NYCFC could never under any circumstances stop him or demand compensation. But when an employee working under a fixed term contract quits to get a new job in the same field, the original employer does have rights. There are limits that vary under law depending on the industry, specific job, and such. If a chef is under contract with a restaurant and wants to leave, her employer can probably stop her from working for or opening a new restaurant in the same neighborhood or city or maybe even a few counties away. But they probably couldn't stop her from doing so in another state in another time zone. But the market for soccer players and coaches is international and that fans watch games all over the world means that employers will generally have rights internationally. Leaving the country is not a free ticket that allows you to violate contract terms.

Finally, most people do not work under fixed-time-period contracts, so the employer can fire you at any time and you can quit at any time and neither side has much recourse against the other absent something like discrimination or harassment. All of the above only applies when there is an employment contract for a specific period of time.

And to your last question, the point is to simply enforce the principle that though the big and strong get to do what they want they also have to pay a price. It's natural that both players and coaches will want to move from MLS to bigger, more lucrative opportunities. And the league and its clubs should facilitate that. But they should do so without being chumps that just get stepped on at the whim of big clubs and big stars. Rooney had a contract that protected him for a fixed period of time in case he was injured, or if his skills rapidly deteriorated. Vieira had a contract that protected him against the possibility that NYCFC became unhappy with his performance and wanted to can him. Both could demand to be paid until the contract ended no matter almost anything. The price for that is you cannot leave for a better similar job without offering something back in return besides not being paid after you quit.
they could of also mutually agreed to terminate the contract. we dont know ( talking about Viera not rooney cuz i still feel other rules apply for players) and then no harm no foul, or maybe he actually resigned and nycfc didnt want to cock block especially if rumors were true that he and his family wanted to go back home. perhaps nycfc found it pointless to drag this on for the 6 months left on that contract.
like you said we dont know the language, maybe there was a clause that said he is free to go if an offer from france came around if there was less than a year left in his contract. i read of similar clauses but for NT jobs.


as far as the topic of principle? lol this is MLS, rules being made up/changed every year and lets certain teams do as they please or get away with things.

EDIT: i dont think its worth getting worked up for a contract on its last months for PV. Rooney makes more sense since he has i think 2 years left.
 

SoupInNYC

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He was a DP, but he won’t in the future, and DC will replace him with another DP, so if they’re still paying him owed money then they’re essentially paying an extra DP. That money should either be canceled on exit, paid out on exit, or if continued as an annuity it’s a cap hit against a non-DP (full yearly amount), or they get one less DP on the roster while paying it.

Otherwise, then every team should just backload extremely long contracts so that they can drop players but not be cap-charged since they’re not on the roster (which doesn’t make sense).
But I still don't think it matters since he was a DP. There's no real value gained by the club from a cap perspective, which is the reason the rules are put into place.
  1. Backloading contracts doesn't mean shit in MLS from a cap-perspective as its the average yearly value that hits the cap (for a non-DP). So backloading only affects cash flow for a club, which sure, may benefit some clubs from a financial perspective, but still, I don't think MLS cares because there's no roster advantage being seen.
  2. Assuming it is a DP, again, what's the advantage being given? Let's say that Rooney's contract all along in this scenario was to be a 1.5 year deal with all that money spread across the 1.5 years. It has the exact same effect on their roster as this other arrangement because he is a DP and nobody cares how much $ is spent once that tag is applied.
What benefit, roster-wise, would a club receive for doing this with a player that was a DP his whole time on the club?
 
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Ulrich

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But I still don't think it matters since he was a DP. There's no real value gained by the club from a cap perspective, which is the reason the rules are put into place.
  1. Backloading contracts doesn't mean shit in MLS from a cap-perspective as its the average yearly value that hits the cap (for a non-DP). So backloading only affects cash flow for a club, which sure, may benefit some clubs from a financial perspective, but still, I don't think MLS cares because there's no roster advantage being seen.
  2. Assuming it is a DP, again, what's the advantage being given? Let's say that Rooney's contract all along in this scenario was to be a 1.5 year deal with all that money spread across the 1.5 years. It has the exact same effect on their roster as this other arrangement because he is a DP and nobody cares how much $ is spent once that tag is applied.
What benefit, roster-wise, would a club receive for doing this with a player that was a DP his whole time on the club?
Principle of it. He won’t be a DP any longer. Your 1.5 year scenario is fine, but if wanted by all parties, then write it like that. The last thing this league needs are Knicks-style contracts being paid long after the player(s) leave.
 

SoupInNYC

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Principle of it. He won’t be a DP any longer. Your 1.5 year scenario is fine, but if wanted by all parties, then write it like that. The last thing this league needs are Knicks-style contracts being paid long after the player(s) leave.
Don't forget about the Mets too!

 

gbservis

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ESPN is reporting on it, too.
DC signing Özil would definitely be a slapping-your-dick-down-on-the-table kind of move.
I think Ozil will struggle in the MLS with many of his creative passes and other talents being wasted by far less talented players in the same way we saw so many passes from Pirlo go to waste on the receiving end. I'm also interested to see how Ozil reacts when MLS players just start hacking him, he's not a very physical player and has a history of disappearing for long stretches when he's unhappy about how things are going.
 

NickA

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I think Ozil will struggle in the MLS with many of his creative passes and other talents being wasted by far less talented players in the same way we saw so many passes from Pirlo go to waste on the receiving end. I'm also interested to see how Ozil reacts when MLS players just start hacking him, he's not a very physical player and has a history of disappearing for long stretches when he's unhappy about how things are going.
I was thinking the same thing. He is going to hate getting hacked.
 

moogoo

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I was thinking the same thing. He is going to hate getting hacked.
not only that... ozil is just completely lazy as a player. if he doesn't feel like playing, for one reason or another, he's perfectly happy just walking along. he has practically zero defensive work ethic and DC can't really afford to have one less person defending. i don't know what DC are thinking even trying to get ozil other than "hey we need another big name to get buts in seats.." but is ozil have the same fame as rooney? i think not.
 

Keith Putnam

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According to The Athletic, DC United's meeting with Özil is actually about his coffee shop chain.

Özil’s representatives are indeed set to meet with United officials soon, but the primary purpose of the meeting is to discuss plans to open a location of the star’s coffee shop in the southwest corner of Audi Field. That corner retail space – currently used by the team as a bike valet, got some new exterior branding a few months back: the glass windows now bear vinyl sheets with the logo of 39 Steps Coffee.​

 

JayH

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According to The Athletic, DC United's meeting with Özil is actually about his coffee shop chain.

Özil’s representatives are indeed set to meet with United officials soon, but the primary purpose of the meeting is to discuss plans to open a location of the star’s coffee shop in the southwest corner of Audi Field. That corner retail space – currently used by the team as a bike valet, got some new exterior branding a few months back: the glass windows now bear vinyl sheets with the logo of 39 Steps Coffee.​

It's difficult to determine whether this is satirical or not.
 

Schwallacus

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It's difficult to determine whether this is satirical or not.
Based on the image of the corner spot being covered with the "39 Steps Coffee" vinyl posters, I'd say it's real. Unless they're going the route of the Onion and got a good photoshopper to place that there.
 
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