2021 Roster Discussion

JayH

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Just because he may not be obviously "the one" doesn't mean he isn't a good talent add. Guy seems like he has a nose for the goal and could play LW too. To be upset at this target doesn't make sense in vacuum and the assumption that they won't bring in other attackers besides this player is speculative pessimism.
The fear is that they don't also target a top-talent striker who scores goals in big games. We just aren't going to challenge for cups with Taty, Isi, etc. This guy may be fine to fill some depth. Maybe a target like this would be a productive fill-the-roster signing. But this club has the money and we have the spots to bring in a Vela or Zlatan type who will score those season-changing goals we have been missing. I don't think they go for the A plus moves until they have a stadium to market, but it will still be fun/interesting to see how this off-season plays out.
 

moogoo

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The fear is that they don't also target a top-talent striker who scores goals in big games. We just aren't going to challenge for cups with Taty, Isi, etc. This guy may be fine to fill some depth. Maybe a target like this would be a productive fill-the-roster signing. But this club has the money and we have the spots to bring in a Vela or Zlatan type who will score those season-changing goals we have been missing. I don't think they go for the A plus moves until they have a stadium to market, but it will still be fun/interesting to see how this off-season plays out.
We have all (myself included) been saying we need a striker who will score in big games like a Vela or Zlatan. but we need to remember, neither Vela nor Zlatan have won any "big game" trophies in MLS. The teams who have won MLS Cup in recent years, also have not relied on a big name scorer, but rather a collective effort from the team to make it happen in the playoffs and big games.

I would love to have a big name or two on the roster and I definitely think they could add a lot in terms of leadership and performance/goals (if we get lucky and they don't fall flat on their faces), but building a collective WINNING team mentality with talented players, I think is more important.

in 2019, we were one of the best teams in the league at coming back from behind and that takes a certain mentality to do time and time again. this past season, if we went down, it just seemed like we crumbled.
 

JayH

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We have all (myself included) been saying we need a striker who will score in big games like a Vela or Zlatan. but we need to remember, neither Vela nor Zlatan have won any "big game" trophies in MLS. The teams who have won MLS Cup in recent years, also have not relied on a big name scorer, but rather a collective effort from the team to make it happen in the playoffs and big games.

I would love to have a big name or two on the roster and I definitely think they could add a lot in terms of leadership and performance/goals (if we get lucky and they don't fall flat on their faces), but building a collective WINNING team mentality with talented players, I think is more important.

in 2019, we were one of the best teams in the league at coming back from behind and that takes a certain mentality to do time and time again. this past season, if we went down, it just seemed like we crumbled.
And still an empty shelf without even sniffing a cup. That’s comparing apples to oranges, it doesn’t matter whether either of those two has any trophies. The analysis is what a top striker of the quality of Zlatan or Vela (whoever they were) would have looked like on our own roster the last couple of seasons. Instead we had an absent Mitrita.
 

413Blue

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Sometimes you just need to go get a guy that has done it at a level above MLS.
While a good idea and the approach I'd like to take with at least one DP, that strategy has been just as fraught with underwhelming and complete failure signings in the league.
 
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Shwafta

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While a good idea and the approach I'd like to take with at least one DP, that strategy has been just as fraught with underwhelming and complete failure signings in the league.
Same can't be said about ticket sales. IF we do that, ticket sales would go up, as well. So maybe it is worth it on that perspective alone, at least once in a while.
 
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ZYanksRule

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I think the issue is we try and get cute with these under the radar guys in no name leagues. Medina. Mitri. Heber.

Sometimes you just need to go get a guy that has done it at a level above MLS.
Everyone always remembers the Almirons, the Velas, the Zlatans, etc. There are a ton of examples of guys who didn't cut it here. Most teams have a poor record of making overseas signings just because of how difficult it is to find diamonds in the rough.
 

moogoo

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And still an empty shelf without even sniffing a cup. That’s comparing apples to oranges, it doesn’t matter whether either of those two has any trophies. The analysis is what a top striker of the quality of Zlatan or Vela (whoever they were) would have looked like on our own roster the last couple of seasons. Instead we had an absent Mitrita.
we had a villa and it didn't happen when it counted. a guy who has scored at the highest level and in the biggest games. sometimes it's about the team mentality more than the superstar.

while i agree the superstar can make that special difference, and i don't think it is the perfect solution for our lack of success in the post season.

as ZYanks said, there's more failure than success when signing a superstar from abroad. I still think signing a superstar would be beneficial for the team for marketing and selling tickets to fill the seats. bonus if he actually performs and does what he's brought in to do.

If we can find another signing like Villa, that'd be great. If we can somehow convince Messi AND Suarez to come play for us, that'd be a dream. lol.
 

ZYanksRule

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we had a villa and it didn't happen when it counted. a guy who has scored at the highest level and in the biggest games. sometimes it's about the team mentality more than the superstar.

while i agree the superstar can make that special difference, and i don't think it is the perfect solution for our lack of success in the post season.

as ZYanks said, there's more failure than success when signing a superstar from abroad. I still think signing a superstar would be beneficial for the team for marketing and selling tickets to fill the seats. bonus if he actually performs and does what he's brought in to do.

If we can find another signing like Villa, that'd be great. If we can somehow convince Messi AND Suarez to come play for us, that'd be a dream. lol.
Yes -- don't get me wrong. I'm not against signing a big-name player. I just don't think that's what we "need." We need a guy who can put the ball in the net. Frankly, we need multiple guys who can put the ball in the net, I would like to see a complete refreshing of our forward group.
 

SoupInNYC

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I think the issue is we try and get cute with these under the radar guys in no name leagues. Medina. Mitri. Heber.

Sometimes you just need to go get a guy that has done it at a level above MLS.
What team that has won MLS Cup in the last 5 years didn't "try and get cute with under the radar guys in no name leagues"?
 
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JayH

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Everyone always remembers the Almirons, the Velas, the Zlatans, etc. There are a ton of examples of guys who didn't cut it here. Most teams have a poor record of making overseas signings just because of how difficult it is to find diamonds in the rough.
With our resources, bottomless pockets, and a renowned scouting system, there is no excuse for our not signing one of the everyone-always-remembers type guys. CFG should be at or near the top of signing an Almiron or Martinez caliber gem, and/or being on the right side of signing a Villa (as they did, leaving aside the off-the-field stuff) rather than a Higuain. For the most part, they haven't been trying. My initial point was that we have a glaring hole at striker, which has proven to be a season-ender, and we have the ability (in fact, a much greater ability than most clubs) to go all-in to address that. The question is whether or not they are interested in doing that at this point. If their response is the random target from earlier in the thread, they are missing an opportunity and leaving resources on the table. They are continuing to strive for the B+ squad rather than the A. As I also mentioned, that may be the game plan for the time being, save the money for now, particularly before there is no stadium to market and we do not even have a consistent home field.
 

mgarbowski

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What I love is that this never ending discussion won't be even potentially resolved by Opening Day because the club will probably sign 1 DP this window and leave 1 for summer, and the 1 this window won't be a big name, allowing both optimists and pessimists to claim validation.
 

ZYanksRule

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With our resources, bottomless pockets, and a renowned scouting system, there is no excuse for our not signing one of the everyone-always-remembers type guys. CFG should be at or near the top of signing an Almiron or Martinez caliber gem, and/or being on the right side of signing a Villa (as they did, leaving aside the off-the-field stuff) rather than a Higuain. For the most part, they haven't been trying. My initial point was that we have a glaring hole at striker, which has proven to be a season-ender, and we have the ability (in fact, a much greater ability than most clubs) to go all-in to address that. The question is whether or not they are interested in doing that at this point. If their response is the random target from earlier in the thread, they are missing an opportunity and leaving resources on the table. They are continuing to strive for the B+ squad rather than the A. As I also mentioned, that may be the game plan for the time being, save the money for now, particularly before there is no stadium to market and we do not even have a consistent home field.
I really think we're all underrating Maxi Moralez in this conversation. A year ago he had 20 assists one of three players in league history to do that. The previous year he had 16 assists. He has more than double the amount of assists as any other player in team history. Just because we had never heard of him before, and just because his salary was lower than the Villa/Lampard/Pirlo trifecta, we consistently underrate him. The guy was that caliber of signing here.

Yes I agree we need a big-time striker, yes I agree we should go all-in to acquire that player. Where we disagree is in the idea that CFG isn't trying to go after those guys. They took a massive swing for Mitrita, but it didn't work out.
 
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JayH

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I really think we're all underrating Maxi Moralez in this conversation. A year ago he had 20 assists one of three players in league history to do that. The previous year he had 16 assists. He has more than double the amount of assists as any other player in team history. Just because we had never heard of him before, and just because his salary was lower than the Villa/Lampard/Pirlo trifecta, we consistently underrate him. The guy was that caliber of signing here.

Yes I agree we need a big-time striker, yes I agree we should go all-in to acquire that player. Where we disagree is in the idea that CFG isn't trying to go after those guys. They took a massive swing for Mitrita, but it didn't work out.
I have always been a big Maxi fan. And he played 150 games in tier 1 - Serie A - before coming here. Yeah, Mitrita was definitely a wild, off the radar swing, which was a big miss. I say they can spend even more and swing better. With that said, I hope we are both right on what they need to do! Unlike before last season, they have no choice but to make several roster moves before and during this season, so we will learn a lot as to how they plan to manage the near term.
 
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moogoo

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I have always been a big Maxi fan. And he played 150 games in tier 1 - Serie A - before coming here. Yeah, Mitrita was definitely a wild, off the radar swing, which was a big miss. I say they can spend even more and swing better. With that said, I hope we are both right on what they need to do! Unlike before last season, they have no choice but to make several roster moves before and during this season, so we will learn a lot as to how they plan to manage the near term.
or they can pull a red bull and just not get any DPs for the entire 2021 season. sign some players to fill out the roster and wait until things are more settled cause of covid before they bring in any DPs... maybe focus all their efforts on a stadium before they bring in a big money DP. it would suck but they could be gambling that fans will come back once a stadium opens.

do i think this is the way they'll go? no. i really hope they don't. just saying it's possible. other teams have gone without DPs and with the financial difficulties and uncertainty of the season, they might be looking to hold onto their cash right now.
 
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JayH

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or they can pull a red bull and just not get any DPs for the entire 2021 season. sign some players to fill out the roster and wait until things are more settled cause of covid before they bring in any DPs... maybe focus all their efforts on a stadium before they bring in a big money DP. it would suck but they could be gambling that fans will come back once a stadium opens.

do i think this is the way they'll go? no. i really hope they don't. just saying it's possible. other teams have gone without DPs and with the financial difficulties and uncertainty of the season, they might be looking to hold onto their cash right now.
Some version of this remains possible. I still think that the NYCFC 2.0 starts once the stadium is announced/opened, and we remain in a holding pattern acquisition strategy until then.
 
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LionNYC

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Some version of this remains possible. I still think that the NYCFC 2.0 starts once the stadium is announced/opened, and we remain in a holding pattern acquisition strategy until then.
I think we're already in NYCFC 2.0...

Villa/Lampard/Pirlo was NYCFC 1.0

Non $6M salary DPs is NYCFC 2.0
 
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