MLS vs NASL

[Fantazma]

Not necessarily going to disagree with any of that but that's not my point. What you're saying is that for those reasons the NASL is a third-rate league but what I'm saying is that MLS is a second-rate league because we won't pay our players. I don't want to lose Harrison in a year or two because we can't pay him a decent salary. Same with Mix. With no cap hit implications nobody'd be talking about having to get rid of him.

And I get that the league wants to make sure it survives long-term. But for now at least that means we're just not as good quality-wise as other leagues.

well yea.....until there is more money and stability for clubs it will be like this. if you want to open flood gates fine.....but we saw in the 80's what happened when that was the case. i still dont think the sport is popular enough for it to survive domestically on its own.

and honestly players get taken away all the time due to higher salary, this happens all over the world even those with open structures and no salary cap.


EDIT: oh and miami plays tomorrow on ESPN3 for those interested in poku.....or if you into NASL i think they are airing another game on CBS Sports network

 

[21Architect]

They have 12 people at their games and a crappy TV contract that no one watches.

I mean, I get that NASL attendance is nowhere near MLS attendance but there were at least 3,000 people at the last Strikers match I was at in Ft.Lauderdale and South Florida is a really shitty sports town. I imagine sides like Indy 11 get way more bodies in the seats than that.

 

[QuigrNYCFC]

http://www.empireofsoccer.com/dempsey-bradley-yedlin-at-center-of-u-s-youth-clubs-lawsuit-50529/

US youth teams sue MLS players union and players for not following FIFA rules.

 

[Fantazma]

http://www.empireofsoccer.com/dempsey-bradley-yedlin-at-center-of-u-s-youth-clubs-lawsuit-50529/

US youth teams sue MLS players union and players for not following FIFA rules.

anyone has context on this? so bascially and transfer fee of any player that gets bought from MLS ...that money doesnt trickle down to the youth team?

i know rule is a certain percentage is supposed to get sent to youth team.

 

[Ulrich]

This is a frivolous lawsuit - just because it's a FIFA statue doesn't make it legal. ALL of the youth teams listed are Pay-to-Play, so they are getting compensated by each player's family, and the players are on single season registrations per the applications. These clubs are now trying to Double-dip by asking for a piece of the transfer fees - which they'd be entitled to if their organizations were 100% free to the players (coaching, travel, etc). They can't have it both ways - asking for families to pay and then reaping a windfall way down the road after their services were already compensated for. Additionally, each of the kids have to leave the youth teams because there isn't a setup for them to graduate to - so the kids aren't being poached away, which if they were poached before making the senior team a piece of the pie is owed (like in Europe)

MLS academies can collect future transfer fees because they are all free to players and there is a series of advanced teams for them to step to as they get older/better.

 

[Falastur]

This is a frivolous lawsuit - just because it's a FIFA statue doesn't make it legal. ALL of the youth teams listed are Pay-to-Play, so they are getting compensated by each player's family, and the players are on single season registrations per the applications. These clubs are now trying to Double-dip by asking for a piece of the transfer fees - which they'd be entitled to if their organizations were 100% free to the players (coaching, travel, etc). They can't have it both ways - asking for families to pay and then reaping a windfall way down the road after their services were already compensated for. Additionally, each of the kids have to leave the youth teams because there isn't a setup for them to graduate to - so the kids aren't being poached away, which if they were poached before making the senior team a piece of the pie is owed (like in Europe)

MLS academies can collect future transfer fees because they are all free to players and there is a series of advanced teams for them to step to as they get older/better.

I was going to comment more lenghtily, but you pretty much said it all for me.

The reason this rule exists is twofold: partly to reward clubs for their part in building a really top-level player (i.e. one who fetches a serious transfer fee) and also partly to try to prevent big(ger) clubs from snatching away promising youths from smaller teams for peanuts with the lure of big wages and a higher level of competition.

I have some sympathy for a small youth organisation wanting a pat on the head because their little 12 year old from down the street became the next Messi and they were there first to recognise his talent and nurture him. However, ultimately they aren't missing out on holding onto his registration after he's turned 18 because they can't play players at adult level, so the idea that they are somehow missing out on his services is entirely spurious.

 

[Keith Putnam]

An article examining what the big money signing of Poku might say about the current state of the NASL:
http://fiftyfive.one/2016/07/poku-age-panic-nasl/

 

[Gazza_55]

What's to get angry about? Hmmm, let's see.

Poku contract owned by MLS: $67k-ish if I remember right
MLS contracts: capped amount per team
vs.
Poku contract with Miami team: $millions
NASL contracts: negotiated freely

Gee, sure woulda been nice to keep Poku, but hey, no need to get angry he can get a 10x salary increase with Miami that gets him more money than almost all of our players. Combined.

If you think Miami paying a player 10 times more than he's worth is going to lead any NASL team to overtake any MLS team you are dreaming. It doesn't matter who owns the contract. And every MLS contract is negotiated freely - unless you have some evidence that the player was threatened with physical violence when signed up to get paid $67k.......

Poku was a bench player, according to PV, and the team decided he's not worth millions. No league structure in the world has a remedy for a manager who thinks a player is not good.

Lastly, if the NASL has no cap on contracts and MLS does - why do NASL teams pay less for players than MLS teams? Shouldn't it be the opposite?

 

[Seth]

If you think Miami paying a player 10 times more than he's worth is going to lead any NASL team to overtake any MLS team you are dreaming. It doesn't matter who owns the contract. And every MLS contract is negotiated freely - unless you have some evidence that the player was threatened with physical violence when signed up to get paid $67k.......

Poku was a bench player, according to PV, and the team decided he's not worth millions. No league structure in the world has a remedy for a manager who thinks a player is not good.

Lastly, if the NASL has no cap on contracts and MLS does - why do NASL teams pay less for players than MLS teams? Shouldn't it be the opposite?

Really? You're going to dredge up discussions from two months ago? OK.

First off, it appears you did not at all understand anything I was saying. Reading comprehension, dude! Nowhere did I say an NASL team was going to "overtake" an MLS team, so you can take your "you are dreaming" and shove it. "Threatened with physical violence when signed up"? What kind of stupid comment is that? And how did you get that from anything I was saying? Poku not worth millions? Maybe not, but at least he got a decent payday. Good for him! I think it's ridiculous that our players are (probably) getting paid less than our sales reps. NASL teams paying less for players? Well, sure, it's not as big or as popular a league. That has nothing to do with MLS though. It's a travesty that a lot of our players are barely getting paid enough to live comfortably in our city.

Lastly, you want to have a reasonable discussion of player salaries? Great! But it looks like you're being more of a troll, so I'm just gonna say screw you, buddy. And hey, it's Friday afternoon and I've had enough of the work week already so if I've totally misinterpreted what you've said, well, life goes on I suppose.

 

[SoupInNYC]

If you think Miami paying a player 10 times more than he's worth is going to lead any NASL team to overtake any MLS team you are dreaming. It doesn't matter who owns the contract. And every MLS contract is negotiated freely - unless you have some evidence that the player was threatened with physical violence when signed up to get paid $67k.......

Poku was a bench player, according to PV, and the team decided he's not worth millions. No league structure in the world has a remedy for a manager who thinks a player is not good.

Lastly, if the NASL has no cap on contracts and MLS does - why do NASL teams pay less for players than MLS teams? Shouldn't it be the opposite?

I don't think you understand things quite well.

Sure Poku negotiated his contract and came into the league at a low pay. Yes, he had to agree to that himself. And when he signed it made sense considering he had yet to make a name for himself. However, the MLS caps the salary increases a player can receive within the CBA. So barring extreme circumstances where the MLS decides to bend the rules, Poku could not have made close to that kind of money next year, even if he was playing 90' every match and netted 15 goals.

Your last paragraph is really, really shortsighted. NASL teams generally pay less for players because there is little interest in that league and they are cash-strapped. Yes some teams will drop money on a player here and there, but the teams don't have the funds to consistently pay more. The lack of a cap really doesn't come into play.

 

[413Blue]

Sure Poku negotiated his contract and came into the league at a low pay. Yes, he had to agree to that himself. And when he signed it made sense considering he had yet to make a name for himself. However, the MLS caps the salary increases a player can receive within the CBA. So barring extreme circumstances where the MLS decides to bend the rules, Poku could not have made close to that kind of money next year, even if he was playing 90' every match and netted 15 goals.

Not familiar with that segment of the CBA, but i'm assuming it's no different than other US leagues. If a player signed a contract and then exceeds that value, the contract does not change. They can renegotiate or sell the player, but it's not a mandate for any league to do so, just as an underperforming player is not going to have his salary cut. Once his contract expires, a player can test his market value within MLS, internationally, within lower US leagues, or a career outside of soccer.

People knock MLS salaries, and for good reason, but let's not try and have pity for the players. What percentage of 24 year olds on the national level, without a college degree, are earning 67k? The league minimum for lower roster players is 50k I believe. It's not like they are being exploited, and they are not even forced to play soccer.

 

[SoupInNYC]

Not familiar with that segment of the CBA, but i'm assuming it's no different than other US leagues. If a player signed a contract and then exceeds that value, the contract does not change. They can renegotiate or sell the player, but it's not a mandate for any league to do so, just as an underperforming player is not going to have his salary cut. Once his contract expires, a player can test his market value within MLS, internationally, within lower US leagues, or a career outside of soccer.

People knock MLS salaries, and for good reason, but let's not try and have pity for the players. What percentage of 24 year olds on the national level, without a college degree, are earning 67k? The league minimum for lower roster players is 50k I believe. It's not like they are being exploited, and they are not even forced to play soccer.

Oh don't get me wrong, I'm not making the players out to be exploited or anything. I'm just saying there are very valid reasons to leave MLS in order to pursue a bigger payday, since there is a cap on increase in pay within MLS.

From a deadspin article I found:
Players making less than $100k have a 125% increase limit on salary
Players making between $100k-$200k have a 120% increase limit
Players making over $200k have a 115% increase limit