2024 Roster and Transfer Discussion Thread

We have reportedly had a few of these types of deals fall apart in the final stages over the years. Total speculation but I often wonder if being seen as part of deep-pocketed CFG has its downsides with agents going deep into negotiations just to raise the profile of their client or things breaking down at the end when the agent/player gets too greedy with their demands because in their mind its CFG so what's another $1M to them.

Obviously, there are massive benefits to being part of CFG that offset these downsides. I'm not complaining more trying to sort out why we seem to end up in this situation so often.
Relatedly I wonder if sometimes foreign agents and players think the MLS rules are not as rigid as advertised. So when a club says the most we can offer you is $x because of MLS salary rules, it is brushed aside, because of course no one takes that seriously. Combine that with CFG's reputation for both spending wildly and at least allegedly breaking FFP rules willy-nilly, and I can imagine it can get frustrating for David when he has to explain, no, we can really only pay you $x maximum.
 
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Relatedly I wonder if sometimes foreign agents and players think the MLS rules are not as rigid as advertised. So when a club says the most we can offer you is $x because of MLS salary rules, it is brushed aside, because of course no one takes that seriously. Combine that with CFG's reputation for both spending wildly and at least allegedly breaking FFP rules willy-nilly, and I can imagine it can get frustrating for David when he has to explain, no, we can really only pay you $x maximum.
Yes to this generally. Though of course in this case, if he was coming in as a DP (with one of ours to be bought down) then there is no $ maximum.
 
This is interesting and goes to the heart of a lot of our debates here.


Entire thread:
"There has been a defining shift in MLS roster building strategy this winter that should be the story so far of 2024. It is a smart shift that is likely to change the makeup of the league for the next few years for the better.

Why are MLS clubs now buying 24-26 year olds?

It starts in Europe. Outside of the truly massive clubs, most teams have begun looking at their roster as a balance sheet. A player 24-26 on a four year contract is a depreciating asset, as their contract will conclude in the back half of their career.

This means everyone is in on 18-22 year olds. The market is inflated, and any player with upside is a target. However, players who are late developers are left without a European market. Now, MLS...with the money to spend, enters the picture.

Lagerway's Atlanta strategy epitomizes this, as does LAFC and Bouanga. These players are very good, but are too old for most European clubs to invest in them. They can be stars in MLS, and MLS has a very robust pay scale.

Now, a 2-5m transfer fee can get you a top quality 24-26 year old. 7-12m can get you a best XI player who will re-sign with you. That same price gets you far less than it used to with young players.

So how do you develop players to sell? MLS academies and Next Pro can fulfill that role. A team full of 25-27 year old players in their prime, of proven international quality, supported by Academy products gives you the best of both worlds. 'This is the way' (courtesy @pweemsatl)"


NYCFC is not doing this. We don't have a roster of mostly mid-to-late-20s guys supported by Academy players. NYCFC has some mid-20s guys in midfield and defense but nearly the entire front line is non-Academy youth.

Here is a list of NYCFC recent transfer acquisitions from abroad and their age at time of transfer. With Martinez as an outlier, NYCFC favors younger transfers on offense and buys the 24-26 year olds mostly on defense/midfield.

Tanasijević 26
Risa 25
Martinez 24
Wolf 24
Bakrar 22
Ojeda 19
Fernandez 19
Ilenic 18

TBA?
[Mijatovic] 18

There's some logic to this. The selling upside for developing offensive producers is highest. The flip side is it leaves you with very uncertain offensive production and based on 2023 I've learned that apparently you need to score goals to win. The other downside is that the most successful younger guys want to leave when they hit their prime, and our plan is to do exactly that, selling them at a profit. Acquire someone when they 24-26 and, as the thread notes, they might very well re-sign so you can have them from 24-32, which is a player's most productive period generally.

Also, if the younger guys don't develop as hoped, you end up serially loaning them out to Brazil and then China which basically sucks for everyone including very much the player. Or you hold on like with Talles hoping he recovers enough to sell at a profit. It might happen, or you might end up like the investor who refuses to sell a stock that went down 40% because people hate to take losses but stocks that tank during a healthy market are probably more likely to go down another 40% than to get back to previous highs.
 
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This is interesting and goes to the heart of a lot of our debates here.


Entire thread:
"There has been a defining shift in MLS roster building strategy this winter that should be the story so far of 2024. It is a smart shift that is likely to change the makeup of the league for the next few years for the better.

Why are MLS clubs now buying 24-26 year olds?

It starts in Europe. Outside of the truly massive clubs, most teams have begun looking at their roster as a balance sheet. A player 24-26 on a four year contract is a depreciating asset, as their contract will conclude in the back half of their career.

This means everyone is in on 18-22 year olds. The market is inflated, and any player with upside is a target. However, players who are late developers are left without a European market. Now, MLS...with the money to spend, enters the picture.

Lagerway's Atlanta strategy epitomizes this, as does LAFC and Bouanga. These players are very good, but are too old for most European clubs to invest in them. They can be stars in MLS, and MLS has a very robust pay scale.

Now, a 2-5m transfer fee can get you a top quality 24-26 year old. 7-12m can get you a best XI player who will re-sign with you. That same price gets you far less than it used to with young players.

So how do you develop players to sell? MLS academies and Next Pro can fulfill that role. A team full of 25-27 year old players in their prime, of proven international quality, supported by Academy products gives you the best of both worlds. 'This is the way' (courtesy @pweemsatl)"


NYCFC is not doing this. We don't have a roster of mostly mid-to-late-20s guys supported by Academy players. NYCFC has some mid-20s guys in midfield and defense but nearly the entire front line is non-Academy youth.

Here is a list of NYCFC recent transfer acquisitions from abroad and their age at time of transfer. With Martinez as an outlier, NYCFC favors younger transfers on offense and buys the 24-26 year olds mostly on defense/midfield.

Tanasijević 26
Risa 25
Martinez 24
Wolf 24
Bakrar 22
Ojeda 19
Fernandez 19
Ilenic 18

TBA?
[Mijatovic] 18

There's some logic to this. The selling upside for developing offensive producers is highest. The flip side is it leaves you with very uncertain offensive production and based on 2023 I've learned that apparently you need to score goals to win. The other downside is that the most successful younger guys want to leave when they hit their prime, and our plan is to do exactly that, selling them at a profit. Acquire someone when they 24-26 and, as the thread notes, they might very well re-sign so you can have them from 24-32, which is a player's most productive period generally.

Also, if the younger guys don't develop as hoped, you end up serially loaning them out to Brazil and then China which basically sucks for everyone including very much the player. Or you hold on like with Talles hoping he recovers enough to sell at a profit. It might happen, or you might end up like the investor who refuses to sell a stock that went down 40% because people hate to take losses but stocks that tank during a healthy market are probably more likely to go down another 40% than to get back to previous highs.

As a non-twitter user I can't thank you enough for passing along the full thread. The fact that you can no longer read twitter without an account is incredibly frustrating.

This sounds about right and I'm not opposed to this model. Assuming NYCFC stays the course going younger on the attacking side I'd like to see us splurge a bit on an experienced, proven, high-end DP like Maxi or Villa (on-field contributions only) to play alongside the young prospects. This would give us consistent production to offset the inevitable variability of the young players and give them an on-field leader to help organize the attack and mentor the young guys.

Unfortunately, our player in this role right now is Santi and I don't think he's the right fit. He's young and inconsistent right alongside the other guys. While his passion is very evident I'm not sure his temperament, communication, and leadership style are doing much to raise his young teammates up. We need an encouraging Maxi type that calmly directs, not Santi either losing his head at the ref or pointing at his feet at the top of the box while he scowls at his 18-year-old teammate and barks at him for not giving him the ball where he wanted it.
 
While his passion is very evident I'm not sure his temperament, communication, and leadership style are doing much to raise his young teammates up. We need an encouraging Maxi type that calmly directs, not Santi either losing his head at the ref or pointing at his feet at the top of the box while he scowls at his 18-year-old teammate and barks at him for not giving him the ball where he wanted it.
This is my issue with Santi; he's not cool and commanding, which are essential leadership traits. That being said, he still has time to grow and mature and develop, so the story is not yet written. I hope he has it in him. But it could go either way.

This season is going to be huge for him. If we're lucky, he'll follow Yogi Berra's advice: "When you come to a fork in the road, take it."
 
This is interesting and goes to the heart of a lot of our debates here.


Entire thread:
"There has been a defining shift in MLS roster building strategy this winter that should be the story so far of 2024. It is a smart shift that is likely to change the makeup of the league for the next few years for the better.

Why are MLS clubs now buying 24-26 year olds?

It starts in Europe. Outside of the truly massive clubs, most teams have begun looking at their roster as a balance sheet. A player 24-26 on a four year contract is a depreciating asset, as their contract will conclude in the back half of their career.

This means everyone is in on 18-22 year olds. The market is inflated, and any player with upside is a target. However, players who are late developers are left without a European market. Now, MLS...with the money to spend, enters the picture.

Lagerway's Atlanta strategy epitomizes this, as does LAFC and Bouanga. These players are very good, but are too old for most European clubs to invest in them. They can be stars in MLS, and MLS has a very robust pay scale.

Now, a 2-5m transfer fee can get you a top quality 24-26 year old. 7-12m can get you a best XI player who will re-sign with you. That same price gets you far less than it used to with young players.

So how do you develop players to sell? MLS academies and Next Pro can fulfill that role. A team full of 25-27 year old players in their prime, of proven international quality, supported by Academy products gives you the best of both worlds. 'This is the way' (courtesy @pweemsatl)"


NYCFC is not doing this. We don't have a roster of mostly mid-to-late-20s guys supported by Academy players. NYCFC has some mid-20s guys in midfield and defense but nearly the entire front line is non-Academy youth.

Here is a list of NYCFC recent transfer acquisitions from abroad and their age at time of transfer. With Martinez as an outlier, NYCFC favors younger transfers on offense and buys the 24-26 year olds mostly on defense/midfield.

Tanasijević 26
Risa 25
Martinez 24
Wolf 24
Bakrar 22
Ojeda 19
Fernandez 19
Ilenic 18

TBA?
[Mijatovic] 18

There's some logic to this. The selling upside for developing offensive producers is highest. The flip side is it leaves you with very uncertain offensive production and based on 2023 I've learned that apparently you need to score goals to win. The other downside is that the most successful younger guys want to leave when they hit their prime, and our plan is to do exactly that, selling them at a profit. Acquire someone when they 24-26 and, as the thread notes, they might very well re-sign so you can have them from 24-32, which is a player's most productive period generally.

Also, if the younger guys don't develop as hoped, you end up serially loaning them out to Brazil and then China which basically sucks for everyone including very much the player. Or you hold on like with Talles hoping he recovers enough to sell at a profit. It might happen, or you might end up like the investor who refuses to sell a stock that went down 40% because people hate to take losses but stocks that tank during a healthy market are probably more likely to go down another 40% than to get back to previous highs.
I also wonder about the young guys who get transferred from MLS to Europe at 21 or 22 but don't succeed enough to warrant a long career at the top level, if they would consider coming back? For example, both Taty and Yangel are doing fine but not setting the world on fire. Neither will ever play for Man City. Yangel is not an every game starter in a team that (barring this season) is a midtable or worse team in La Liga. Taty is a sub to an ageing star in Lazio, and nowhere close to dislodging him. If 3-4 years from now their offers are bottom feeders in La Liga, or teams in Belgium or Portugal or Russia, would they consider DP contracts from MLS? Would such contracts make sense? I am not talking about guys like Vines or Sargent or Mihalovic who are not fit for truly top leagues, but rather guys who are borderline top leagues but also clearly MLS stars. If guys like that are worth a 7-10 million transfer and low DP salary, rather than high ceiling teenagers or aging bigger stars.
 
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This is my issue with Santi; he's not cool and commanding, which are essential leadership traits. That being said, he still has time to grow and mature and develop, so the story is not yet written. I hope he has it in him. But it could go either way.

This season is going to be huge for him. If we're lucky, he'll follow Yogi Berra's advice: "When you come to a fork in the road, take it."

To be fair to Santi on most teams he wouldn't need to be a leader at 24, still early in his own development. I appreciate his passion, he always gives it his all. In some ways, it seems like the volatility that detracts from his leadership abilities is the same energy that drives his on-field success and it may be hard to decouple those things. I also think Santi is in a harder position to lead than players like Villa and Maxi who have played in big European leagues and can say to the young guys listen to me because I've been where you are trying to go. The other young South American players may look at Santi as more of a peer or worse look at him and think if I am here at 24 then I have failed to reach my goals. It's not an easy position to be in, that DP tag carries a lot of weight.
 
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Amusing to pretend they had to clear out Segal’s salary to make room for Mitajovic.

Not his salary, but I think we were at the maximum 30 roster spots. So yes, we had to clear someone out to make room for him.

According to the team website, we have 33 total players - 3 of them loaned out. The maximum is 30. So in order to fit Jovan, someone had to be cut. I think we also need at least one international roster spot, so it wouldn't surprise me if that's the trade.
 
We have four goalkeepers on the team. That doesn't make sense. One of them should have been cut (or just not added) instead of trading Segal. I'd rather than have strikers than four goalkeepers.
 
We have four goalkeepers on the team. That doesn't make sense. One of them should have been cut (or just not added) instead of trading Segal. I'd rather than have strikers than four goalkeepers.

It's not even just the goalies -- look at how many NYCFC II players are roster. We have far too many academy players taking up spots on the roster when those spots are so finite.

Christian McFarlane
Maximo Carrizo
Jonathan Shore
Zidane Yanez
Drew Baiera
Alex Rando

That's six players taking up spots on the first team that, frankly, aren't likely to see any time with the first team this season. Ultimately I don't have a real problem with dropping Segal -- he's a dime a dozen player and we now have so much depth up front that we aren't likely to feel his loss. But we have a lot of teenagers on the roster who won't see any minutes for the first team.

That being said, we do have a ridiculous amount of depth right now. We have eight forwards/attacking midfielders who I feel very comfortable giving minutes to. (Not even including Malachi Jones or Andres Jasson). Even with those six guys taking up space, we have a ridiculous amount of first-choice options.
 

This seems like a real statement by the team. To not give the No. 7 shirt away until now -- then to give it to this kid -- that's a real statement of intent on what they think Jovan will be. The more I read about him, the more excited I get over this signing.
It's a silly post by the kid. Alfredo Morales wore number 7 for three season. The number 7 is available now as Morales is no longer on the squad.

2, 3, 4, 7, and 8 are available as of now.

 
It's not even just the goalies -- look at how many NYCFC II players are roster. We have far too many academy players taking up spots on the roster when those spots are so finite.

Christian McFarlane
Maximo Carrizo
Jonathan Shore
Zidane Yanez
Drew Baiera
Alex Rando

That's six players taking up spots on the first team that, frankly, aren't likely to see any time with the first team this season. Ultimately I don't have a real problem with dropping Segal -- he's a dime a dozen player and we now have so much depth up front that we aren't likely to feel his loss. But we have a lot of teenagers on the roster who won't see any minutes for the first team.

That being said, we do have a ridiculous amount of depth right now. We have eight forwards/attacking midfielders who I feel very comfortable giving minutes to. (Not even including Malachi Jones or Andres Jasson). Even with those six guys taking up space, we have a ridiculous amount of first-choice options.

We still have questions at LB. Like I’m not convince o’toole is the guy nor will he play all the games. Though it seems McFarlane will be the backup so he will probably get minutes.
 
It's a silly post by the kid. Alfredo Morales wore number 7 for three season. The number 7 is available now as Morales is no longer on the squad.

2, 3, 4, 7, and 8 are available as of now.


LOL. Very poor job by me to take that at face value and not even think about it.

EDIT: Now I see what he's saying. The last STRIKER to wear that number. Good lord.