White Supremacists In Supporter Section

NickA

Registered
Elite Donor
Donor
Seasoned Supporter
Mar 23, 2015
2,058
4,121
323
So no one outside of Christopher Jee Christopher Jee is going to comment on my post 2 pages ago?
Well since most on here embrace the other violent group ANTIFA, it's almost a moot point. But I'll reply anyway.

As far as @NYCFirm's tweet-thread. He's no normie. He's a self described Marxist, which is the extreme end of socialism. As many are anti-fascists, there are just as many that are anti-socialists. Most of us inherently lean one way or another. I personally would classify as an independent. I have conservative beliefs with some liberal views. I have the capacity to see other opinions that I may not agree with. But someone like @NYCFirm is blinded by their ideology. Just like any neo-nazi group is too. He's an ANTIFA groupie in a pissing match with the other side.

Normal people would prefer that both sides be expelled from the stadium. Maybe that shouldn't happen unless some type of action actually takes place, but it's slippery because waiting for something to happen instead of acting now may be foolish. Action probably works better than reaction in this case. BUT the problem is that it is completely one sided. Citing left media and ANITFA supporters are of course going to slant it one way. It's even happening here. I'm reading posts where it's obvious some have no idea what they are saying and reciting talking points from their circles. Where are the calls on this forum to rid the stadium from both extremes?! Where's the MLS surrogates that they are parading around doing damage control debouncing it?

All these off-shoot far right groups are a product of combating ANTIFA's means of silencing the right in general. Even Proud Boys which started as a joke gained their political traction as a counter measure to combat ANTIFA. That is what caused parts are their group to be infiltrated by some neo-nazis. Extremism breeds extremism. There's a saying that sunlight is the best disinfectant. But by having one ideological view pushing one side into darkness. That breeds the hate. That is what causes the oppressed (right or wrong) to want to act out. The FBI does not consider the Proud Boys an extremist group. That was a media created designation that the left believe. The DHS and FBI has accused ANTIFA as anarchist extremists and describe their activities as domestic terrorism. In fact NJ was the first state to label ANTIFA as a terrorist organization. Anyone citing the well-known far left SPLC's classification of right wing groups while they also openly dismiss any violent leftists groups or militias as such are simply being naive. The newest chairman of the Proud Boys Enrique Tarrio identifies as an Afro-Cuban and wants to know how he's classified as the leader of a white supremacist group. Just because the SPLC says so?!


This isn't a statement on which side anyone falls on. There's a fine line between ideology and fact. The fact is that both sides have violent factions and neither should be allowed. Everyone should stand up against all forms of extremism that uses intimidation to silence others. For some reason too many people choose politics over people and can't see the big picture.
 

LionNYC

Registered
Staff member
Elite Donor
Seasoned Supporter
Jan 2, 2015
15,972
27,811
303
New York, NY
Well since most on here embrace the other violent group ANTIFA, it's almost a moot point. But I'll reply anyway.

As far as @NYCFirm's tweet-thread. He's no normie. He's a self described Marxist, which is the extreme end of socialism. As many are anti-fascists, there are just as many that are anti-socialists. Most of us inherently lean one way or another. I personally would classify as an independent. I have conservative beliefs with some liberal views. I have the capacity to see other opinions that I may not agree with. But someone like @NYCFirm is blinded by their ideology. Just like any neo-nazi group is too. He's an ANTIFA groupie in a pissing match with the other side.

Normal people would prefer that both sides be expelled from the stadium. Maybe that shouldn't happen unless some type of action actually takes place, but it's slippery because waiting for something to happen instead of acting now may be foolish. Action probably works better than reaction in this case. BUT the problem is that it is completely one sided. Citing left media and ANITFA supporters are of course going to slant it one way. It's even happening here. I'm reading posts where it's obvious some have no idea what they are saying and reciting talking points from their circles. Where are the calls on this forum to rid the stadium from both extremes?! Where's the MLS surrogates that they are parading around doing damage control debouncing it?

All these off-shoot far right groups are a product of combating ANTIFA's means of silencing the right in general. Even Proud Boys which started as a joke gained their political traction as a counter measure to combat ANTIFA. That is what caused parts are their group to be infiltrated by some neo-nazis. Extremism breeds extremism. There's a saying that sunlight is the best disinfectant. But by having one ideological view pushing one side into darkness. That breeds the hate. That is what causes the oppressed (right or wrong) to want to act out. The FBI does not consider the Proud Boys an extremist group. That was a media created designation that the left believe. The DHS and FBI has accused ANTIFA as anarchist extremists and describe their activities as domestic terrorism. In fact NJ was the first state to label ANTIFA as a terrorist organization. Anyone citing the well-known far left SPLC's classification of right wing groups while they also openly dismiss any violent leftists groups or militias as such are simply being naive. The newest chairman of the Proud Boys Enrique Tarrio identifies as an Afro-Cuban and wants to know how he's classified as the leader of a white supremacist group. Just because the SPLC says so?!


This isn't a statement on which side anyone falls on. There's a fine line between ideology and fact. The fact is that both sides have violent factions and neither should be allowed. Everyone should stand up against all forms of extremism that uses intimidation to silence others. For some reason too many people choose politics over people and can't see the big picture.
Well, the NYCFC Anti-Fascists twitter account followed me this morning. I felt uneasy about that.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Sabo

Amon

Registered
Seasoned Supporter
Apr 14, 2015
517
725
93
28
NYC

Yeah, the frustrating thing about all of this is that I still don't get what these guys are about, and no one's talking to the evidence.

To me talking about banning and all this doxxing / guilt by association is mostly noise.
The guy for the most part is an idiot he's trying to doxx anybody who sat in the supporter's section and was even remotely close to any of the said nazis. He's posted a picture of my friend's facebook picture with his name on it and is try to say he's part of that bullshit. Which can have some serious negative effects not only in the stadium but personal life with work and all. Dude should really do better research.
 

Kangaroo Jack

Registered
Sep 11, 2017
1,442
3,544
233
Where women glow and men plunder
The guy for the most part is an idiot he's trying to doxx anybody who sat in the supporter's section and was even remotely close to any of the said nazis. He's posted a picture of my friend's facebook picture with his name on it and is try to say he's part of that bullshit. Which can have some serious negative effects not only in the stadium but personal life with work and all. Dude should really do better research.
i wouldnt say hes an idiot, id say hes reckless.
 

SoupInNYC

Registered
Elite Donor
Mar 9, 2015
5,157
11,882
303
32
UES
The guy for the most part is an idiot he's trying to doxx anybody who sat in the supporter's section and was even remotely close to any of the said nazis. He's posted a picture of my friend's facebook picture with his name on it and is try to say he's part of that bullshit. Which can have some serious negative effects not only in the stadium but personal life with work and all. Dude should really do better research.
I thought most of those where he identified names, there was then associated other backup with it? When going through some of what he posted, I noticed a few familiar faces in pictures, but none of them had names identified or anything like that.

Now, that said, I haven't gone through his posts in a while and it's also quite possible that there were some that I missed.
 

Christopher Jee

Registered
Elite Donor
Donor
Seasoned Supporter
Jul 24, 2014
3,486
9,099
353
36
The guy for the most part is an idiot he's trying to doxx anybody who sat in the supporter's section and was even remotely close to any of the said nazis. He's posted a picture of my friend's facebook picture with his name on it and is try to say he's part of that bullshit. Which can have some serious negative effects not only in the stadium but personal life with work and all. Dude should really do better research.
Agreed, and I've told him so personally and said the same thing in public forums. Likewise about people I'm friendly with. Like I've already said, it's at best a distraction, at worst has completely backfired on him and what I think he'd like to see happen.

Aside from the serious negative effects that we seem to agree upon, shaming and other forms of negative reinforcement just don't tend to work. Calling for bans which are difficult to enforce in consistent ways in public forums has just divided people. I think if one wants to stand for tolerance and inclusivity, there are far more positively reinforcing ways to do that. I hope we see some of them, because the negativity clearly hasn't worked.
 

Amon

Registered
Seasoned Supporter
Apr 14, 2015
517
725
93
28
NYC
I thought most of those where he identified names, there was then associated other backup with it? When going through some of what he posted, I noticed a few familiar faces in pictures, but none of them had names identified or anything like that.

Now, that said, I haven't gone through his posts in a while and it's also quite possible that there were some that I missed.
He posted some more I believe yesterday and my friend was one of the people he's trying to accuse. Can't even go into the supporter's section any more without being called a nazi. Stuff like that can cause for an unsafe environment for innocent people at the stadium also can get them questioned by FO. When in fact they have nothing to do with any of that. We don't even follow politics, just trying to get drunk and enjoy the game seriously.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Christopher Jee

joe

Registered
Elite Donor
Donor
Seasoned Supporter
May 18, 2015
2,158
4,120
323
39
Well since most on here embrace the other violent group ANTIFA, it's almost a moot point. But I'll reply anyway.

As far as @NYCFirm's tweet-thread. He's no normie. He's a self described Marxist, which is the extreme end of socialism. As many are anti-fascists, there are just as many that are anti-socialists. Most of us inherently lean one way or another. I personally would classify as an independent. I have conservative beliefs with some liberal views. I have the capacity to see other opinions that I may not agree with. But someone like @NYCFirm is blinded by their ideology. Just like any neo-nazi group is too. He's an ANTIFA groupie in a pissing match with the other side.

Normal people would prefer that both sides be expelled from the stadium. Maybe that shouldn't happen unless some type of action actually takes place, but it's slippery because waiting for something to happen instead of acting now may be foolish. Action probably works better than reaction in this case. BUT the problem is that it is completely one sided. Citing left media and ANITFA supporters are of course going to slant it one way. It's even happening here. I'm reading posts where it's obvious some have no idea what they are saying and reciting talking points from their circles. Where are the calls on this forum to rid the stadium from both extremes?! Where's the MLS surrogates that they are parading around doing damage control debouncing it?

All these off-shoot far right groups are a product of combating ANTIFA's means of silencing the right in general. Even Proud Boys which started as a joke gained their political traction as a counter measure to combat ANTIFA. That is what caused parts are their group to be infiltrated by some neo-nazis. Extremism breeds extremism. There's a saying that sunlight is the best disinfectant. But by having one ideological view pushing one side into darkness. That breeds the hate. That is what causes the oppressed (right or wrong) to want to act out. The FBI does not consider the Proud Boys an extremist group. That was a media created designation that the left believe. The DHS and FBI has accused ANTIFA as anarchist extremists and describe their activities as domestic terrorism. In fact NJ was the first state to label ANTIFA as a terrorist organization. Anyone citing the well-known far left SPLC's classification of right wing groups while they also openly dismiss any violent leftists groups or militias as such are simply being naive. The newest chairman of the Proud Boys Enrique Tarrio identifies as an Afro-Cuban and wants to know how he's classified as the leader of a white supremacist group. Just because the SPLC says so?!


This isn't a statement on which side anyone falls on. There's a fine line between ideology and fact. The fact is that both sides have violent factions and neither should be allowed. Everyone should stand up against all forms of extremism that uses intimidation to silence others. For some reason too many people choose politics over people and can't see the big picture.
A lot of fine people on both sides, am I right? :neutral:

Handwaving about sides and extremism in general is beside the point. In the specific issue we're discussing:

- One side includes individuals who have been arrested for politically motivated violence, the other does not
- One side includes individuals demonstrated to be members of racist groups, the other does not
- One side is threatening and calling for violence against the other, the other is not
 

Kangaroo Jack

Registered
Sep 11, 2017
1,442
3,544
233
Where women glow and men plunder
I thought most of those where he identified names, there was then associated other backup with it? When going through some of what he posted, I noticed a few familiar faces in pictures, but none of them had names identified or anything like that.

Now, that said, I haven't gone through his posts in a while and it's also quite possible that there were some that I missed.
as i said. hes reckless. Especially when the name of the person was directly in the photo he posted. (for claritly, i dont know any of these people, neither in the picture or in the comments)
 

Amon

Registered
Seasoned Supporter
Apr 14, 2015
517
725
93
28
NYC
as i said. hes reckless. Especially when the name of the person was directly in the photo he posted. (for claritly, i dont know any of these people, neither in the picture or in the comments)
The dude on the left is a buddy of mine. Has nothing to do with any of the B/S thats going on. Directly posted a photo from his facebook with his name on it.
 

Christopher Jee

Registered
Elite Donor
Donor
Seasoned Supporter
Jul 24, 2014
3,486
9,099
353
36
A lot of fine people on both sides, am I right? :neutral:

Handwaving about sides and extremism in general is beside the point. In the specific issue we're discussing:

- One side includes individuals who have been arrested for politically motivated violence, the other does not
- One side includes individuals demonstrated to be members of racist groups, the other does not
- One side is threatening and calling for violence against the other, the other is not
I don't think that that's what NickA NickA is saying. Quite the opposite really, he's saying there are violent people on both sides. The other issue I have with invoking this phrase is that it reinforces the idea that there are only two sides, as does most political discourse and in fact a decent chunk of our electoral and democratic processes (I'm thinking first-past-the-post and the primary system in particular).

I think we can all agree that politically motivated violence, racist (and other forms of discrimination) groups and threatening violence is undesirable. If anything, what's emerged to me is that there are two other, completely orthogonal sides - those who condemn those things and those who don't. And people who condemn those things belong on "both sides" of the traditional left-right political spectrum, as do people who don't. Historically I very much belong on the left side of the left-right spectrum, but this and other conflicts arising in our day and age have me very much hewing to the non-violent (vs. violent) side.
 

NickA

Registered
Elite Donor
Donor
Seasoned Supporter
Mar 23, 2015
2,058
4,121
323
A lot of fine people on both sides, am I right? :neutral:

Handwaving about sides and extremism in general is beside the point. In the specific issue we're discussing:

- One side includes individuals who have been arrested for politically motivated violence, the other does not
- One side includes individuals demonstrated to be members of racist groups, the other does not
- One side is threatening and calling for violence against the other, the other is not
This is factually wrong. The FBI and Department of Homeland Security has recognized ANTIFA as a violent anacharist organization. The state of NJ has them listed as a domestic terrorist group. But yeah Joe they hand out poppies and sing songs of peace. I wonder if you really believe what you are saying or you are so biased you don't know the difference.
 

NickA

Registered
Elite Donor
Donor
Seasoned Supporter
Mar 23, 2015
2,058
4,121
323
I don't think that that's what NickA NickA is saying. Quite the opposite really, he's saying there are violent people on both sides. The other issue I have with invoking this phrase is that it reinforces the idea that there are only two sides, as does most political discourse and in fact a decent chunk of our electoral and democratic processes (I'm thinking first-past-the-post and the primary system in particular).

I think we can all agree that politically motivated violence, racist (and other forms of discrimination) groups and threatening violence is undesirable. If anything, what's emerged to me is that there are two other, completely orthogonal sides - those who condemn those things and those who don't. And people who condemn those things belong on "both sides" of the traditional left-right political spectrum, as do people who don't. Historically I very much belong on the left side of the left-right spectrum, but this and other conflicts arising in our day and age have me very much hewing to the non-violent (vs. violent) side.
That's exactly what I'm saying and I'm man enough to admit both sides have extremist issues without making excuses. I appreciate you actually being able to speak like a normal person. Separation of sides only makes things worse. There are many studies that suggest exposing two opposing sides to each other creates a better environment in the end. I can give af about politics. It's all bullshit anyway and too many people are blinded by their affiliation to see the disruption it causes.
 

joe

Registered
Elite Donor
Donor
Seasoned Supporter
May 18, 2015
2,158
4,120
323
39
This is factually wrong. The FBI and Department of Homeland Security has recognized ANTIFA as a violent anacharist organization. The state of NJ has them listed as a domestic terrorist group. But yeah Joe they hand out poppies and sing songs of peace. I wonder if you really believe what you are saying or you are so biased you don't know the difference.
You're confounding Black Bloc with anti-fascism writ large in the exact way you complained the yahoo piece collapsed the far-right gangs we're talking about with conservatism. At no point did I deny - or comment on - the existence of an extreme left in the wider world.

And again, the thread is about NYCFC supporters. Not political extremism as general concept.
 

Gotham Gator

Registered
Donor
Feb 9, 2015
10,538
21,936
353
54
Bronxville, NY
Agreed, and I've told him so personally and said the same thing in public forums. Likewise about people I'm friendly with. Like I've already said, it's at best a distraction, at worst has completely backfired on him and what I think he'd like to see happen.

Aside from the serious negative effects that we seem to agree upon, shaming and other forms of negative reinforcement just don't tend to work. Calling for bans which are difficult to enforce in consistent ways in public forums has just divided people. I think if one wants to stand for tolerance and inclusivity, there are far more positively reinforcing ways to do that. I hope we see some of them, because the negativity clearly hasn't worked.
 
  • Like
Reactions: adam

FredMertz

Registered
Elite Donor
Donor
Seasoned Supporter
Jun 2, 2014
2,669
5,582
323
38
Well since most on here embrace the other violent group ANTIFA, it's almost a moot point. But I'll reply anyway.

As far as @NYCFirm's tweet-thread. He's no normie. He's a self described Marxist, which is the extreme end of socialism. As many are anti-fascists, there are just as many that are anti-socialists. Most of us inherently lean one way or another. I personally would classify as an independent. I have conservative beliefs with some liberal views. I have the capacity to see other opinions that I may not agree with. But someone like @NYCFirm is blinded by their ideology. Just like any neo-nazi group is too. He's an ANTIFA groupie in a pissing match with the other side.

Normal people would prefer that both sides be expelled from the stadium. Maybe that shouldn't happen unless some type of action actually takes place, but it's slippery because waiting for something to happen instead of acting now may be foolish. Action probably works better than reaction in this case. BUT the problem is that it is completely one sided. Citing left media and ANITFA supporters are of course going to slant it one way. It's even happening here. I'm reading posts where it's obvious some have no idea what they are saying and reciting talking points from their circles. Where are the calls on this forum to rid the stadium from both extremes?! Where's the MLS surrogates that they are parading around doing damage control debouncing it?

All these off-shoot far right groups are a product of combating ANTIFA's means of silencing the right in general. Even Proud Boys which started as a joke gained their political traction as a counter measure to combat ANTIFA. That is what caused parts are their group to be infiltrated by some neo-nazis. Extremism breeds extremism. There's a saying that sunlight is the best disinfectant. But by having one ideological view pushing one side into darkness. That breeds the hate. That is what causes the oppressed (right or wrong) to want to act out. The FBI does not consider the Proud Boys an extremist group. That was a media created designation that the left believe. The DHS and FBI has accused ANTIFA as anarchist extremists and describe their activities as domestic terrorism. In fact NJ was the first state to label ANTIFA as a terrorist organization. Anyone citing the well-known far left SPLC's classification of right wing groups while they also openly dismiss any violent leftists groups or militias as such are simply being naive. The newest chairman of the Proud Boys Enrique Tarrio identifies as an Afro-Cuban and wants to know how he's classified as the leader of a white supremacist group. Just because the SPLC says so?!


This isn't a statement on which side anyone falls on. There's a fine line between ideology and fact. The fact is that both sides have violent factions and neither should be allowed. Everyone should stand up against all forms of extremism that uses intimidation to silence others. For some reason too many people choose politics over people and can't see the big picture.
I’d be shocked if anyone here supports antifa in any meaningful way.

Remember that the political spectrum is a circle — the ultra far right and the ultra far left meet 180 degrees away from the middle.
 

Kangaroo Jack

Registered
Sep 11, 2017
1,442
3,544
233
Where women glow and men plunder
You're confounding Black Bloc with anti-fascism writ large in the exact way you complained the yahoo piece collapsed the far-right gangs we're talking about with conservatism. At no point did I deny - or comment on - the existence of an extreme left in the wider world.

And again, the thread is about NYCFC supporters. Not political extremism as general concept.
there is literally a twitter handle labeled NYCFCAntifa and it has a ton of followers. One of which is Tommy Miles who is one of the top retweets for that page. Please stop trying to tell me that there is not also antifa at the games.

https://twitter.com/NYCFCAntifa

EDIT: for further clarity i am not claiming Tommy is or isnt ANTIFA and playing his stupid dangerous game.
 

Ulrich

Registered
Elite Donor
Donor
Seasoned Supporter
Nov 5, 2015
13,883
26,506
353
there is literally a twitter handle labeled NYCFCAntifa and it has a ton of followers. One of which is Tommy Miles who is one of the top retweets for that page. Please stop trying to tell me that there is not also antifa at the games.

https://twitter.com/NYCFCAntifa

EDIT: for further clarity i am not claiming Tommy is or isnt ANTIFA and playing his stupid dangerous game.
You have whataboutism down to a science.

Twitter followers do not constitute membership. A twitter handle does not constitute attendance at games.
 
  • Like
Reactions: joe