We'll see. Atlanta started off gangbusters too.
David Lee Departs NYCFC for SKC
- Thread starter twsj91
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We'll see. Atlanta started off gangbusters too.
The focus on Ojeda and Fernandez in another thread reminds me of something Lee said with which I disagree, at least partially.
“We've been a below-average discretionary-spend team on our three DPs, three U22s the entire tenure I've been here...”
Maybe we haven't matched the top few, but "below average?" I don't think that's true, especially for the U22 spots.
The key metric for U22s is the transfer fee, since that amount is unlimited. The salaries still count against the cap. Right now, we have Julian Fernandez ($5 million), Augustin Ojeda ($5.5 million), and the currently loaned-out Mijatovic ($8.6 million). That's $19.1 million in transfer fees, which doesn't seem like it lags behind what others in the league are doing. We also recently transferred out Mounsef Bakrar, whom we had signed for $2 million.
For DPs, we currently have two, with an additional one loaned out. There is Thiago Martins, with a transfer fee of $4.3 million and a salary of $2.16 million, which combines for a $3.24 million annual charge over his 4-year contract. We have the freshly minted Nico Fernandez Mercau, with his transfer fee of $8.4 million. He's so freshly minted that his salary is not public, but conservatively assuming it's in the $1.0-1.5 million range, that would put him in $3 million territory as well. Talles Magno was signed for $8 million and has a $1.1 million salary, which again puts him in the $3 million range. No, that's not the level of the very top of MLS - nor is it at the level we were in 2015-2017, with three six million dollar men on the squad. But it's a reasonable spend, and I suspect it puts us in the top third, at least.
“We've been a below-average discretionary-spend team on our three DPs, three U22s the entire tenure I've been here...”
Maybe we haven't matched the top few, but "below average?" I don't think that's true, especially for the U22 spots.
The key metric for U22s is the transfer fee, since that amount is unlimited. The salaries still count against the cap. Right now, we have Julian Fernandez ($5 million), Augustin Ojeda ($5.5 million), and the currently loaned-out Mijatovic ($8.6 million). That's $19.1 million in transfer fees, which doesn't seem like it lags behind what others in the league are doing. We also recently transferred out Mounsef Bakrar, whom we had signed for $2 million.
For DPs, we currently have two, with an additional one loaned out. There is Thiago Martins, with a transfer fee of $4.3 million and a salary of $2.16 million, which combines for a $3.24 million annual charge over his 4-year contract. We have the freshly minted Nico Fernandez Mercau, with his transfer fee of $8.4 million. He's so freshly minted that his salary is not public, but conservatively assuming it's in the $1.0-1.5 million range, that would put him in $3 million territory as well. Talles Magno was signed for $8 million and has a $1.1 million salary, which again puts him in the $3 million range. No, that's not the level of the very top of MLS - nor is it at the level we were in 2015-2017, with three six million dollar men on the squad. But it's a reasonable spend, and I suspect it puts us in the top third, at least.
Lee took over as sporting director in 2019, didn't he?
Anyway, he was with us from the beginning and had a couple key roles under Claudio before stepping into Reyna's shoes, so whatever we were before 2019, he was a big part of that, too. For good or ill.
I had a similar reaction to his statement. I can and do believe we've been on the low end of DP spend for a while, though (once we finally signed Lampard and Pirlo) at least we always had 3 before the U22 option came along. Not all clubs could say that.
But I find it hard to accept we've been on the low end of U-22 transfer spend. And in the last years before the U22 category existed, we used Young DP in similar fashion, spending a decent chunk on Talles but a lower salary.
LAFC has already far surpassed Atlanta for consistent excellence. Atlanta was bad in its 4th year. You might discount it because it was 2020, but they've never been above 1.50 PPG since.
After a dismal Year 1, which LAFC and Atlanta only avoided because of different expansion rules, NYCFC went 7 years without dipping below 1.50 PPG. We only went above 1.70 once in that time at 1.88.
LAFC has a less consistent pattern, but they have more extreme highs. They have had 2 bad years below 1.40 PPG in their first 8, but also a 1.88, 1.97, and 2.12.
Philly was above 2.0 in 2020, has a chance to exceed 2.00 this year, hit 1.97 in 2022, and from 2019 to now has 1 year (2024) below 1.50.
How about this for a wild theory on the abrupt split: David Lee, who shockingly had full autonomy all along, refused to abandon his “develop and sell” philosophy because he’s convinced, repeatedly telling anyone who’d listen, that spending money doesn’t win in MLS. CFG, meanwhile, wanted us to be more like LAFC and got fed up when Lee spent the money on guys like Jovan instead of guys like Son. So, they parted ways.
Big signings imminent!
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Timing made a ton of sense to me. Windows are closed and rosters are set and the new team is out of the race so nothing is at stake for a few months there. What better time to get a jump on next year, get a close up look at what parts can be salvaged and what can’t.
As for Lee and CFG I’m convinced that CFG, for all its resources, inhibits all of its sporting directors from moving quickly and buying new parts before selling others or before CFG decides where those players should go. This is even true to some extent at the top. It was in full effect as City didn’t want to sign Donnarumma before it had shipped Ederson out. If the mothership is dojg. It you can be sure it’s enforced even harder at the lower levels. He pretty much can out and said he’s looking forward to being less burdened by the rest of the CFG game system’s want and needs.
I honestly think all his talk of “waiting for the right player” was always company man speak. What GM with bottomless funds would resist stockpiling talent unless compelled to slow down?
That's certainly the way his parting comments read. Let's hope NYC and the shiny new stadium attract someone with talent despite the job frustrations they might face.
Christ, LAFC has been around for SEVEN seasons already? Time is fake. Anyway, not surprised they are ahead of Atlanta but certainly didn't realize we had that big of a sample size.
CFG’s replacement sequencing policy naturally creates some delays, but under Lee those delays often appeared to extend beyond the structural limitations. Key departures like Taty and Sands took multiple windows to address, suggesting an overly deliberate approach that prioritized finding the ideal target over short-term performance needs. While it’s difficult to distinguish CFG’s influence from Lee’s, there’s reason to believe a new sporting director might act more efficiently even within the same organizational framework.
This strikes me as being as close to spot on as we'll ever get.
Taty was replaced very soon after he was sold. Sands hasn’t been sold. We’re don’t replace players on loan. We waste time with loans hoping it increases value and when it doesn’t work (Sands) we just do it again. That’s the issue and I doubt a new exec changes it.
When it does work, like Taty, we spend about 20% on the replacement and the rest on teenagers.
I mean didn't we sign O'Neil to replace Sands?
Lol, yes. Lost track. To be fair we didn't replace him through 1.5 loan periods but then we did.
You are right, I had been thinking about the departure date from the club, not the sold date. Now that you and EganSoccerWords point it out, the replacement rule does seem to unfortunately apply to loans and makes the timing look more like a CFG policy issue. Seems the only way around it is to sell players rather than sending them out on loan, as I know you have advocated for in the case of Sands in the past, if he doesn't want to be here, just sell him. Also, don't waste $8M+ on taking fliers on a guy like Jovan with fewer than 30 career appearances if you are going to be stuck with him for years while he's out on loan.
I think it’s as simple as this. CFG is a huge worldwide enterprise, and like most such enterprises, it has a large bureaucracy. Decisions have to get signed off by a lot of people, and nothing gets done quickly.
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