Kreis Officially Out At NYCFC

canchon said:
Bingo. This is the big mistake. After Orlando won the coin toss and selected the first pick in the expansion draft, Kreis could have selected either the draft or the allocation order. It was a no brainer slam dunk that Larin was the first pick in the draft, so Kreis basically said I'll take the allocation order over Larin.

If Kreis wanted Mix so bad, he should have realized that he could have gotten him even with the #2 pick in the allocation order, because no way Mix is going to Orlando over NYCFC even if Orlando says they want him. They could have swapped an international spot or some trivial allocation money to get Mix. And it turns out it wasn't even needed because OCSC wanted Shea anyway.

So basically Kreis bumbled away a 17 goal rookie of the year candidate because he believed too much in the allocation order/had google eyes for Mix. (Yes, I know it was no given thing that Larin was going to be that good, but it was clear that he was head and shoulders above everyone else in the SuperDraft). Kreis already had Lampard at that time, why did he need Mix so bad? (Yes, Lamps didn't come, but Kreis didn't know that at the time). In Kreis 4-4-2 system, he needs another forward to go up top with Villa. Which he did by reaching for Shelton at #2. Larin >>>>> Shelton and this was known before the draft.
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Yes, because Mix is a proven national team player that went to the World Cup. You're using hindsight.

Cyle Larin was just a kid playing college soccer. College soccer isn't the same as college football and college basketball. It's not the go to source for young up and coming talent. For most players, it's the fall-back plan.

Like I said, Orlando got very lucky but this all isn't even what Midas and I were discussing. He implied that when Kreis misspoke, that was when we lost the SuperDraft to Orlando. That's not true.
 
NYCFCFan10 said:
Let me point out, Orlando took the Expansion Draft ahead of the SuperDraft.

Meaning, Orlando put more importance on selecting first amongst MLS teams undesirable players than on selecting Cyle Larin.

But you guys will ignore that fact because it doesn't fit your "Kreis is dumb" narrative.
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If you can't be civil in your disagreement then don't bother posting. There are many other Pro-Kreis people here but no need to bash those who aren't.
 
I don't even know everyone's exact point, but this argument is dumb in so many levels. We're guessing that Kreis chose this or that, when we don't know what he was being ordered to do. Not defending him, just saying, people are arguing with assumptions.
 
NYCFCFan10 said:
Come on, bro. You're done.

You said it yourself, they just needed a GK until Tally Hall came back. That's a "proven" back-up GK.

And there was only going to be one selection ahead of them in that Expansion Draft... even if we did take a GK, I doubt the league and the world would be without "proven" GK somewhere.

There's only one Cyle Larin though.

But keep kicking and screaming...
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You're trying to split hairs and only ending up with split ends. Tally Hall didn't start the season, hell he only played 23 games or so, therefore Ricketts was a proven starter for 10 games.
 
NYCFCP said:
I don't even know everyone's exact point, but this argument is dumb in so many levels. We're guessing that Kreis chose this or that, when we don't know what he was being ordered to do. Not defending him, just saying, people are arguing with assumptions.
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This. He's not our coach anymore. I was in game day chats and I swear 99% of people were pissed during lineup reveal and the game. Yet we seem to have 40% pissed about the firing. Whatever he was handed he didn't do with it what he was expected to do thus he was fired and you can't argue that he did enough.
 
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NYCFCP said:
I don't even know everyone's exact point, but this argument is dumb in so many levels. We're guessing that Kreis chose this or that, when we don't know what he was being ordered to do. Not defending him, just saying, people are arguing with assumptions.
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Exactly.

We don't know what he knew about interested parties wanting to return to MLS. You assume he picked it for Mix but we don't know.

We know Alejandro Bedoya has been looking at coming home, too.

But the guy that fails to grasp that Orlando picked a 10 game back-up GK over Cyle Larin seems to think he knows.
 
NYCFCFan10 said:
Exactly.

We don't know what he knew about interested parties wanting to return to MLS. You assume he picked it for Mix but we don't know.

We know Alejandro Bedoya has been looking at coming home, too.

But the guy that fails to grasp that Orlando picked a 10 game back-up GK over Cyle Larin seems to think he knows.
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Again, let me connect the dots for you.... Tally Hall was recovering from ACL injury - Orlando had no idea if he'd be able to play - so Orlando drafted a GK that they felt confident could play the entire season if needed. In their eyes, not having a sieve in goal was more important than drafting a field player. Orlando got lucky and Hall recovered - but if he hadn't then they had whom they felt was a starting-quality GK for all 34 games. IF Orlando felt Hall could have played on opening day, there wouldn't have been a need for a GK and Orlando undoubtedly would have picked the Super Draft over the Expansion Draft.

As to Bedoya..... perhaps NYCFC had their eyes on him, but up until he was connected to Philly, he had always made comments about not wanting to play in MLS because of the League's contract structure and low salaries.
 
SoupInNYC said:
In this particular instance, we wanted the higher allocation ranking over Orlando. Which, the advantage would give us the ability to choose a player over Orlando, if they happened to want the same player. Orlando selected Brek Shea before we used ours, thus then giving them a higher allocation spot once we used ours on Mix, who Orlando didn't want.

So, we could have had Larin and Mix.
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Maybe, but there's no way to know. We weren't privy to the behind-the-scenes MLS stuff.
Maybe Orlando first came to us and asked if it was OK to try to sign Mix and we said no. Then they said what about Shea and we said go ahead. If that's the case then the allocation order made a difference. I'm not saying that happened, but there's just no way to know. Maybe we even made them give us a few Garber bucks in the process. Again, we don't know.
 
Multiple sources have indicated that Pirlo, Frank Lampard and David Villa played a role in the removal of Kreis, a triumvirate of experienced internationals who did not foresee a positive future for NYCFC with a coach who only had domestic credentials.
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This is what I suspected.

Frank Lampard, everyone, always looking out for NYCFC....
 
mgarbowski said:
Maybe, but there's no way to know. We weren't privy to the behind-the-scenes MLS stuff.
Maybe Orlando first came to us and asked if it was OK to try to sign Mix and we said no. Then they said what about Shea and we said go ahead. If that's the case then the allocation order made a difference. I'm not saying that happened, but there's just no way to know. Maybe we even made them give us a few Garber bucks in the process. Again, we don't know.
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Valid point.
 
Its no coincidence that no one ever likes NYCFCFan10's posts. Hes more of a fan of our ex coach and a hater of CFG than a real NYCFCfan that his username would suggest.

He has yet to name one good thing Kreis has done all season...why he should stay if he lost the locker room...or any of the other numerous questions posed to him and the ever dwindling cult of kreis.

Instead of decides to debate minutiae and insult fellow forum posters. He cant even make proper arguments arguing over the trivial details of the Kreis gaffe vis a vis larin.

I wish our team had:
Larin
Grella
Zisso

hell even Delgado with no count against the cap.

Instead we got Grabavoy, Wingert, and Jacobsen.
 
Oh hey, Gavin, guy who was actively cheering for our team to lose most of the season.

Great post, would read again.

Btw, I have more than double the likes you have.

Stay thirsty, my friend.
 
Ulrich said:
Again, let me connect the dots for you.... Tally Hall was recovering from ACL injury - Orlando had no idea if he'd be able to play - so Orlando drafted a GK that they felt confident could play the entire season if needed. In their eyes, not having a sieve in goal was more important than drafting a field player. Orlando got lucky and Hall recovered - but if he hadn't then they had whom they felt was a starting-quality GK for all 34 games. IF Orlando felt Hall could have played on opening day, there wouldn't have been a need for a GK and Orlando undoubtedly would have picked the Super Draft over the Expansion Draft.

As to Bedoya..... perhaps NYCFC had their eyes on him, but up until he was connected to Philly, he had always made comments about not wanting to play in MLS because of the League's contract structure and low salaries.
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Let me connect the dots for you.

What you're saying, essentially, is we can use hindsight to judge Kreis's decision to get the allocation order because we "only" got Mix Diskerud (a player EVERYONE here was estatic to get when we landed him)

But we can't use hindisht to judge Orlando because...? Bububu Tally Hall could have been out the whole year! You can't use hindsight! They got lucky he came back after 10 games!

I'm not really disagreeing but you're not offering the same terms to Kreis's decisions.

Either we use hindsight for both or neither but you're using it on one and not the other to try and push your Anti-Kreis agenda. Sorry, son, it's not going to happen.
 
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NYCFCFan10 said:
Oh hey, Gavin, guy who was actively cheering for our team to lose most of the season.

Great post, would read again.

Btw, I have more than double the likes you have.

Stay thirsty, my friend.
Click to expand...

Show me one quote where I rooted for them to lose

Also you have 2358 posts and 2362 likes.

I have 639 Posts and 981 likes.

Maths....
 
NYCFCFan10 said:
Let me connect the dots for you.

What you're saying, essentially, is we can use hindsight to judge Kreis's decision to get the allocation order because we "only" got Mix Diskerud (a player EVERYONE here was estatic to get when we landed him)

But we can't use hindisht to judge Orlando because...? Bububu Tally Hall could have been out the whole year! You can't use hindsight! They got lucky he came back after 10 games!

I'm not really disagreeing but you're not offering the same terms to Kreis's decisions.

Either we use hindsight for both or neither but you're using it on one and not the other to try and push your Anti-Kreis agenda. Sorry, son, it's not going to happen.
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Actually no, when this all went down the day of the Selection Process, I was well aware of the current time-space continuum and knew immediately that Kreis had sh!t the bed with his choice. I wasn't standing around saying, "Gosh this is really suspenseful, all of Kreis' insider knowledge of MLS had led him to hope that a prodigal soul decides to come home to play." Nope, I was screaming that he passed up the guaranteed opportunity to select the consensus #1 college pick Larin that would have been a young & cheap roster spot. As it is, the guy Kreis used the spot on, Mix, was always played out of position - Kreis' own words - so why screw up the Draft Selection process only to select lineups that screwed up the use of the selected ?!? That's like camping out all night for the Black Friday sale on upholstered sofas only to use it on the back porch for 7 months of the rainy season. BTW, I was ecstatic to get Mix, but I also assumed Kreis had the tactical awareness to play him in a role he could excel at.

As to Orlando's motives, yeah, I have to use hindsight as I didn't follow them closely or care what their needs were pre-draft. If I was the coach and had a player returning from an ACL injury, I would never assume the player would be ready as scheduled. First, that's a major injury that requires an enormous amount of rehab and patience, and second, no recovery from injury is guaranteed.

And there you go again with the use of "son," it's amusing to a lesser extent, but if that helps you make believe in a father-knows-best kind of way, go for it. I'm going to go back to playing with my wood blocks.
 
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