White Supremacists In Supporter Section
- Thread starter NYCFC_Dan
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I don't think it's a fight to support Nazis but rather what items/actions are necessary for a person to be banned from the stadium/MLS events? I agree that Nazis are shit people and in an ideal society, a group that demeans another based on religious beliefs wouldn't exist. However, we unfortunately have to deal with groups that have ideas like that in our modern society. AsOnly one group is for the annihilation of Jews and it’s not the peopleadam is siding with.
Again, why the hell is this even a debate? Are some people here so morally bankrupt that the hill you want to die on is Nazi rights?
ZYanksRule said above, if they haven't done anything wrong in the stadium, how can MLS/NYCFC/Yankees kick them out? I don't think the argument others have is the rights of Nazis, but rather where is the line drawn to allow or disallow people into the event? Are we going to have a second security gate where you have to show someone your most recent Google search query? Your last 10 instagram posts, or last 10 you were tagged in? Your last 20 tweets? Will there be random searches where people with a tattoo have to strip down and have someone inspect them for a potential Nazi tat? If someone is banned for their actions inside the stadium, are the people around them responsible and liable to be thrown out as well? Again, fuck Nazis. If I see something I will say something. But being in the Supporters Section for 5 years, I have yet to see someone do something that results in them being thrown out without it being warranted. Fights, scuffles, smoke bombs, etc. have resulted in people getting thrown out, and rightfully so. I haven't seen any heils or anti-Semitic actions in the SS, even when there are Nazis in the section.
Maybe I'm standing in the right area or a non-biased section, but I am interested if others in the Supporters section have heard or seen anything regarding white power or Nazi actions??
The Nazis of 1925 weren’t as bad as the Nazis of 1945 either.
The point is that Nazis are bad. Full stop. Let’s not let them feel empowered.
The thing that really pissed me off as I started reading into these guys is that they were given away game privileges. I would love to attend an away game with my son (he’s 4). Do the whole bus down and back with you crazy people that chant and sing all game. That sounds fun.
But a soccer match should be a safe place. I shouldn’t feel concerned that I’m putting my son in a position where he’s sharing a bus with a man (or men) that committed a hate crime.
Who are these people that you’re talking about? Maybe we should be talking about them too.
This isn’t an either or here. Both the Nazis and these other people can be bad. The whataboutism by you is a little startling.
I don't think it's a fight to support Nazis but rather what items/actions are necessary for a person to be banned from the stadium/MLS events? I agree that Nazis are shit people and in an ideal society, a group that demeans another based on religious beliefs wouldn't exist. However, we unfortunately have to deal with groups that have ideas like that in our modern society. As
Again, fuck Nazis. If I see something I will say something. But being in the Supporters Section for 5 years, I have yet to see someone do something that results in them being thrown out without it being warranted. Fights, scuffles, smoke bombs, etc. have resulted in people getting thrown out, and rightfully so. I haven't seen any heils or anti-Semitic actions in the SS, even when there are Nazis in the section.
Maybe I'm standing in the right area or a non-biased section, but I am interested if others in the Supporters section have heard or seen anything regarding white power or Nazi actions??
Do you think the club should punish fans that use NYCFC trademarks in promoting their hate speech?
Yes, if the club logo is being used to promote hate speech of any way, they should be banned and punished for it.
Gotta love my favorite secular federal holiday Christmas
1. You just completely ignored my response to you're judgement call on me and why wearing a kippa isn't a choice, cool.
2. I NEVER called for them to be banned. So why is that your response to me when I refute your statement I'm not an observant Jew, so I'm just making an issue where there isn't one?
I'll clarify myself to you, but at this point I feel like I'm talking to myself. I don't think you can ban anyone for their belief system. But them being there does create an atmosphere where the smart choice is for someone like me to avoid the SS to guarantee I'm not met with violence or hate speech. And that really sucks that a section of the stadium is off-limits to me unless I want to A. test them to see if I'm safe, or B. hide who I am. But the club really can't do anything till they commit a violent act inside the stadium, aside from revoking any special privileges they may have (which I agree they should). What part of anything I'm saying are you taking issue with?
You just said you need proof and then went on to make a statement about others in the stands fighting and causing issues without providing any proof.
There also is proof, if you read the article it’s very well cited.
Exactly, that part infuriated me. That's completely inexcusable from the club, and that's exactly the privileges these guys should get revoked.
And that’s an easy one too.
Club goes to them and says hey guys - you have Nazis in your group. We can’t be seen giving special privileges to Nazis. It’s bad business. Do yourself a favor and clean this up.
Nobody in this forum is the first person to defend nazis as a self-justification for their own biases.
So, just that I'm reading this clearly, this is pretty much what's going on (please correct me if I'm wrong, want to make sure I'm on the same page here as everyone else as I post nonsensical gifs throughout):
Everyone here is in agreement that Nazis are bad.
1. Some people here believe they should be out right banned altogether from the stadium for being Nazis/outside incidents/arrests.
2. Some people here believe they should be allowed in the stadium, but not in the SS and have their rights revoked to any supporter group privileges. (Away day tickets, team events, etc.)
3. Some people here believe they should be left as is because the team shouldn't be policing their fans for political/ideological beliefs, even those as morally skewed as Nazism.
Would this all be a pretty accurate summarization of the conversation at hand here? If so, I pose the following questions and would appreciate a well thought out response, just so I can get a better understanding of peoples ideas on the subject:
If you fall into group 1, how do you propose to identify and ban these people? I understand that some have been identified, but others surely haven't. How would you propose to find out who is a Nazi and who isn't?
If you fall into group 2, how do you purpose the team enforces this? Have a name list of known Nazis so that they cannot access tickets/team events? Have uniformed officers in the supporters section going around with pictures looking for people who don't belong there?
If you fall into group 3, how do you propose the team can make fans in the SS feel safer? Obviously, this is an issue because people do not feel safe for one reason or another (acts of intimidation, just the thought of having Nazis near them making them afraid, etc.)
Everyone here is in agreement that Nazis are bad.
1. Some people here believe they should be out right banned altogether from the stadium for being Nazis/outside incidents/arrests.
2. Some people here believe they should be allowed in the stadium, but not in the SS and have their rights revoked to any supporter group privileges. (Away day tickets, team events, etc.)
3. Some people here believe they should be left as is because the team shouldn't be policing their fans for political/ideological beliefs, even those as morally skewed as Nazism.
Would this all be a pretty accurate summarization of the conversation at hand here? If so, I pose the following questions and would appreciate a well thought out response, just so I can get a better understanding of peoples ideas on the subject:
If you fall into group 1, how do you propose to identify and ban these people? I understand that some have been identified, but others surely haven't. How would you propose to find out who is a Nazi and who isn't?
If you fall into group 2, how do you purpose the team enforces this? Have a name list of known Nazis so that they cannot access tickets/team events? Have uniformed officers in the supporters section going around with pictures looking for people who don't belong there?
If you fall into group 3, how do you propose the team can make fans in the SS feel safer? Obviously, this is an issue because people do not feel safe for one reason or another (acts of intimidation, just the thought of having Nazis near them making them afraid, etc.)
You’re right, my apologies. I just happened to witness it firsthand and forgot not everyone here was right there too, I’ll look for an article now
1) it is a choice. Why can’t you remove it? Is it an article of clothing or something connected directly to your body that cannot be removed? You choose not to remove it. That is a choice.
2) I don’t have issue with your entire point here. As I said earlier, this was one of the most sensible things I’ve read this far. However, as you pointed out, they have not done anything inside the stadium. You being uncomfortable isn’t justification for someone to be tossed. I understand that’s not what you specifically called for, but that is the point I’ve been making with others here. I don’t understand why we’re even debating that because it seems we both agree to that point
Need to hire the inglorious basterds to police the SS.
Also, is no one really gonna point out the whole Nazis in the SS thing?
Why can’t someone making another spectator feel unsafe a good reason to remove them from the stadium?
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