The "haters" in the growing chorus of which I speak aren't fans of other MLS teams; they're NYCFC fans and local people unattached to an MLS team.
Patrick Vieira Appointed As NYCFC Coach
- Thread starter SayWhat44
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The "haters" in the growing chorus of which I speak aren't fans of other MLS teams; they're NYCFC fans and local people unattached to an MLS team.
That may be fair and I was actually excited about Capello. But I also imagine that story might have been more smoke than fire given his price tag.
Maybe. Maybe not.
I would have been very excited for Capello. And I'm very excited for Vieira. They both have very interesting upsides.
That may be. I'm sure MLS will change and grow. But it's useless to even try to guess what the change will be with how out of nowhere rules changes tend to be within MLS. But in terms of parity, I don't think that is going to change anytime soon. They are always going to go out of their way to give the smaller markets a chance to compete by having restrictions. It's just the way the American sports model works.
I can understand the no professional coaching experience argument, but no MLS coaching experience doesn't make any sense. If this is MLS 2.0 or 3.0 and guys like Giovinco can come over from Europe and be the MVP in a single year, I think the same can be said of coaches. SebaG's playing style isn't typical MLS and he's phenomenal.
Kreis came in to build a team and coach it. That didn't work because CFG gave him players he couldn't properly use. I think now we'll have a much more streamlined direction in terms of player acquisition and roster choices. Rather than arguing about no Pirlo, Vieira can focus on the players he has and making them work. A coach to actually coach and develop talent, not build a club.
Kreis came in to build a team and coach it. That didn't work because CFG gave him players he couldn't properly use. I think now we'll have a much more streamlined direction in terms of player acquisition and roster choices. Rather than arguing about no Pirlo, Vieira can focus on the players he has and making them work. A coach to actually coach and develop talent, not build a club.
I don't disagree fundamentally. But chaos will be with us for a while as the league experiences growing pains. Instead of reacting to changes we need to be the change agent brining the changes we want upon others. CFG is one of the ideal candidates for that change. So in the process of getting to the new equilibrium, first mover advantage can be had as the league tries to attract big money and prosperity by catering to the big money first. That advantage will eventually be gone as the league matures. For now there are opportunities to act on. Let the flood of capital flush this league and collide against the barrier of parity and see what happens. If this league becomes a top 5 league in the world in 20 years, it will be because CFG fired the first salvo today that ushers in a new era, regardless of the club's eventual success or failure.
The conventional wisdom outside this forum is that replacing Kreis -- a proven winner in MLS -- after only 1 year with Vieira -- a foreigner who does not understand the intricacies of the MLS salary cap, allocation ranking, super draft, coast to coast travel and artificial turf is completely ridiculous and shows how incompetent NYCFC is and that we are going to be at the bottom of the table for years to come.
The conventional wisdom is wrong. The most important thing a Coach will do for his Club is to figure out how to get his team to win on the pitch. We have Villa, Lampard, Pirlo and Mix in 2016. We have a core of young talent with Poku, TMac, Mullins. Vieira should be able to draw significant talent from MCFC youth to balance out the fact we don't have our own homegrown players yet. We have the attacking talent to win games and play exciting soccer and our Coach does not have to rely on the intricacies of the dispersal draft to be successful.
NYCFC is a new model for a league that is growing in size and importance.
The conventional wisdom is wrong. The most important thing a Coach will do for his Club is to figure out how to get his team to win on the pitch. We have Villa, Lampard, Pirlo and Mix in 2016. We have a core of young talent with Poku, TMac, Mullins. Vieira should be able to draw significant talent from MCFC youth to balance out the fact we don't have our own homegrown players yet. We have the attacking talent to win games and play exciting soccer and our Coach does not have to rely on the intricacies of the dispersal draft to be successful.
NYCFC is a new model for a league that is growing in size and importance.
Pirlo was voted the 7th best player in europe the same season he joined us. Nothing like that has ever happened before in mls.
Torontos model is to have Josh Williams anchoring their defense in the playoffs. No thanks.
Torontos model is to have Josh Williams anchoring their defense in the playoffs. No thanks.
If you still think NYCFC isn't another Chivas USA, you (and CFG) haven't been paying attention to how MLS works.
I mean, the respect of the players is good and all that but the most important thing to me is that Vierra puts his team in the best position to win by starting the best 11 we have and sticking to it.
If Vierra comes in and has total respect from everyone but he starts Grabavoy and doesn't surround Pirlo with the right guys so he can do his thing, it's going to be a frustrating season.
On another note, it didn't matter who this organization signed to be their new head coach. There was always going to be a faction who hated the choice whether it was Capello etc etc.
Let's be clear about one thing.
It is not in MLS' interest to change their financial rules. MLS has already achieved what other Usonian sports leagues are now trying to achieve: mind-numbing parity. MLB, NBA, NFL and NHL are all attempting to do the same thing because it keeps more markets interested deeper into their respective seasons. It also makes "playoffs" more exciting.
It's no coincidence that each and every USA professional league has exciting playoffs and regular seasons full of mediocrity.
It is not in MLS' interest to change their financial rules. MLS has already achieved what other Usonian sports leagues are now trying to achieve: mind-numbing parity. MLB, NBA, NFL and NHL are all attempting to do the same thing because it keeps more markets interested deeper into their respective seasons. It also makes "playoffs" more exciting.
It's no coincidence that each and every USA professional league has exciting playoffs and regular seasons full of mediocrity.
Close your eyes and imagine this... Another NYCFC First! Same starting 11 for 3 straight games!
Gives me shivers...
I am excited to see what Vieira brings to the team, but I think people are getting soft around here. When are we starting the #ReynaOut movement? That's who really has me worried now.
As an MCFC supporter, I would have been more than happy having PV replace Pellegrini at the end of his current contract. He knows the game inside out, will have some extremely good contacts and most importantly, will command the respect of the players (something I think we have lacked at City with Mancini/Pellegrini at times)
I honestly don’t know what some fans expect? Yes, he may be lacking the experience department of management but wasn't Guardiola in the boat same before he took charge of Barca?
This is a great appointment for NYCFC IMO.
I honestly don’t know what some fans expect? Yes, he may be lacking the experience department of management but wasn't Guardiola in the boat same before he took charge of Barca?
This is a great appointment for NYCFC IMO.
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I don't know how he survived, unless his instructions were to let kreis have a final say in everything, and he could point to his failures.
PV won't be anywhere near player acquisition. Yes he'll have some say but as far as negotiations go and knowing about how MLS works, this is not his role.
The same applies with many successful clubs.
There will be a large amount of Scouts/Suit Types/Coaches all around PV advising him and yes he may be given "options" but he won't have free reign like you may have playing FIFA videogames.
PV is predominantly a coach and as such will coach what is given to him. He'll have options on who to coach and choose accordingly, but like I said he won't have free reign.
People on here were getting excited about Capello and comparing him with PV but have failed to overlook the fact Capello has actually managed Vieira at two clubs... Inter and Juve.
Vieira has played under the likes of Roberto Mancini, and to top it all off arguably the best footballing coach in the whole game (Arsene Wenger)
You don't just walk around blindfolded and not picking up/learning anything when most days for however many years you're working under these men.
I find it somewhat funny how deluded many seem to be about the level of MLS and unaware of the equivalent leagues.
To put MLS in comparison, it's probably at the level of League One in my country (England), which is two leagues below our top league.
Put Walsall/Wigan/Gillingham in the MLS right now and they would give your top teams a good battle.
It's not just about names/individuals, it's about the team and plenty of MLS teams would have their asses kicked in League One.
PV was offered the job at Newcastle, an English Premier League club which currently have Steve McClaren as their manager, a guy who has been the assistant to Alex Ferguson and managed England National Team (not that this is good by the way hahaha)
And PV turned down Newcastle as he felt he could achieve better.
NYCFC aren't just a feeder club for my team (city) believe me, we already loan out Academy players to clubs throughout europe, in leagues much stronger than MLS.
When we loaned the likes of Angelino to you, we were doing you a favour as he would get in most (if not all) English Championship clubs and quite a few English Premier League clubs (based on style of play)
I'm not saying PV will be a success, but to say he'll be shit because he has no experience in the MLS as a coach is daft.
You can spend £400m as a manager on players and still look shit (MUFC) and Hiddink.
It's not just the case of throwing money at players, it's also a case of acquiring the right players for the right system implemented by the right coach....
Jurgen Klopp at Dortmund being an example where he didn't spend alot, didn't have the biggest budget in the Bundesliga, but managed to play a style of football which encouraged/developed players to overcome the likes of Bayern Munich (the top dog) and win the league twice.
I'm not saying PV will be better than Klopp but who know's?
Klopp might be a Flop at Liverpool.
This is the beauty of the game - you never know.
I know who i'd rather play under and be coached by.... Vieira any day of the week.
And he isn't just some CFG "shill"
What a wainkstain of a comment, the guy has been in football all of his life, he doesn't need to be a shill for anyone.
He could walk away from football right now and sit on his ass with his World Cup Medal around his neck.
The same applies with many successful clubs.
There will be a large amount of Scouts/Suit Types/Coaches all around PV advising him and yes he may be given "options" but he won't have free reign like you may have playing FIFA videogames.
PV is predominantly a coach and as such will coach what is given to him. He'll have options on who to coach and choose accordingly, but like I said he won't have free reign.
People on here were getting excited about Capello and comparing him with PV but have failed to overlook the fact Capello has actually managed Vieira at two clubs... Inter and Juve.
Vieira has played under the likes of Roberto Mancini, and to top it all off arguably the best footballing coach in the whole game (Arsene Wenger)
You don't just walk around blindfolded and not picking up/learning anything when most days for however many years you're working under these men.
I find it somewhat funny how deluded many seem to be about the level of MLS and unaware of the equivalent leagues.
To put MLS in comparison, it's probably at the level of League One in my country (England), which is two leagues below our top league.
Put Walsall/Wigan/Gillingham in the MLS right now and they would give your top teams a good battle.
It's not just about names/individuals, it's about the team and plenty of MLS teams would have their asses kicked in League One.
PV was offered the job at Newcastle, an English Premier League club which currently have Steve McClaren as their manager, a guy who has been the assistant to Alex Ferguson and managed England National Team (not that this is good by the way hahaha)
And PV turned down Newcastle as he felt he could achieve better.
NYCFC aren't just a feeder club for my team (city) believe me, we already loan out Academy players to clubs throughout europe, in leagues much stronger than MLS.
When we loaned the likes of Angelino to you, we were doing you a favour as he would get in most (if not all) English Championship clubs and quite a few English Premier League clubs (based on style of play)
I'm not saying PV will be a success, but to say he'll be shit because he has no experience in the MLS as a coach is daft.
You can spend £400m as a manager on players and still look shit (MUFC) and Hiddink.
It's not just the case of throwing money at players, it's also a case of acquiring the right players for the right system implemented by the right coach....
Jurgen Klopp at Dortmund being an example where he didn't spend alot, didn't have the biggest budget in the Bundesliga, but managed to play a style of football which encouraged/developed players to overcome the likes of Bayern Munich (the top dog) and win the league twice.
I'm not saying PV will be better than Klopp but who know's?
Klopp might be a Flop at Liverpool.
This is the beauty of the game - you never know.
I know who i'd rather play under and be coached by.... Vieira any day of the week.
And he isn't just some CFG "shill"
What a wainkstain of a comment, the guy has been in football all of his life, he doesn't need to be a shill for anyone.
He could walk away from football right now and sit on his ass with his World Cup Medal around his neck.
And play him on the flanks in an attacking role. He's slippery and has a nose for space to find a good pass or get off a shot.
Speaking of, I hope we stop trying to Arsenal the ball into the damn goal this year. Mix in particular needs to be able to shoot more. He has a pretty good shot inside 25 yards, and those can result in good things even when they are saved.
My understanding is that Saunders will play the first half for PRNT and the second half with NYCFC, similar to Pele's farewell game with the Cosmos and Santos.....
Tengo una pregunta para usted, ¿qué es un "wankstain"?
That is going to drive me crazy not knowing what is it. I really not want to look it up on google in case it's not safe for work.
Come on, man. As others have pointed out, this is the best shortcut available to younger talent under the circumstances. If we become a good proving ground for young CFG talent (and I think you should look at it that way, not as as MC talent) that goes on to do well in better leagues, then it would stand to reason that we will get better loans and acquisitions from other teams. It won't be only English or European clubs, either. It will give us leverage in getting South/Latin American talent, as well. Clubs will see us as a great shop window for the richest league in the world and a destination far more appealing destination from the players' perspective, and that means we get better transfers. That would also mean we are in a position to be more selective and craft good deals with minimal upfront transfer costs in exchange for sell-on fees.
Execute a few of those, and we have a great pipeline.
On big soccer, it was posited that Kreis got his SA contributors via a one-off, informally-arranged showcase put on by a single agent to which Kreis was taken by someone else. He and Garth still got them, but I don't believe he really scouted hidden gems. More like he got one of those lucky bounces whose absence he kept lamenting here.
Let's not forget, more players will have to be added into the league pool in 2017. Having players camped out at the EDS means they don't require protection from that expansion draft. And for the league as a whole, it would behoove MLS to adapt their roster rules in advance of 2017 expansion so that there is enough quality league wide to at least maintain the standard of play. To me, that's a net plus for us. The league will continually evolve to spend more on players, not less. Advantage: NYC and CFG.
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