NYCFC Players Wanted Thread

[Ulrich]

Yeah but that didn't happen in this case. Villa and the Red Bulls were negotiating a contract, MLS came in and gave the Red Bulls 24 hours to finish the contract, or NYCFC would come in. Contract wasn't signed in the window so NYCFC was able to come in and sign him. I don't believe Villa was ever against going to the Red Bulls.

I don't think so. NYCFC & Villa had a contract worked out and MLS told RB they could create a contract to match within 24 hours or they'd forfeit the ability to sign him via discovery. RB was not previously in negotiations and as such they didn't think they could Vet him and get it done that fast - shame on them for claiming a player they weren't prepared to sign by knowing what terms they'd be willing to offer. That's the problem I have with the entire discovery process - if a team claims somebody they most definitely should have the bulk of a contract in place and ready to offer if the player becomes available - tweaking of the contract is normal and shouldn't be the deal-breaker by not having enough time. Regardless, it seems that Villa was more interested in NYCFC anyway - his agent could have easily demanded more time for RB if that's where he wanted to land.

 

[BxLio91]

Also reddit says Tally Hall is gone from Orlando.

 

[Kjbert]

Perry Kitchen and Bill Hamid are off to Europe this winter.

 

[franchise646]

Perry Kitchen and Bill Hamid are off to Europe this winter.

I hope not.

 

[dannd23]

I hope not.

Why?

 

[NYdoesitEZ]

Yeah he was GA, google says his salary is $85k. Pick him up and get the fuck rid of Jacobs0n.

The root of majority of problems is that the salary cap is too low in MLS and that in turn oppress the youth development and deprive the league of important talent pools. as a new MLS observer (but i grew up watching European soccer), it is really perplexing why they want to keep players income at such shockingly low level. Don Gerber needs to figure out a way to drive out the "poor" owners and attract really wealthy owners who don't mind spending a fortune (regardless if they understand soccer/MLS and can get good results or not) on their teams. Let the free market do the work and squeeze out those who can't afford the higher spending (even if it means some smaller media markets will be left behind, it's ok). Let some clubs do well at least. With current rate./system, nobody is doing really well. We need our equivalent of Chelsea/Real/Bayern/Yankees/Cowboys owners to whom money is no object. When they spend, the whole league benefits. At this stage, don't worry about inequality. Get some partial prosperity going first, we worry about parity and equality later. (Btw, La Liga, Serie A, Bundesleague, everywhere you go, where do you see the equality in those leagues?) lets not be shackled by communism in this country that is supposedly to be the most market friendly.

 

[NYCFC_Ajax]

I thought of kekuta mannh from vancouver, any thoughts on him?

 

[NYCFC_Ajax]

If Pirlo or Lamps or Villa are still here, there is no way Torres or anyone like him CAN come to NYCFC. 3 DPs and done.

Then we get rid of lamps, hasnt been useful

 

[mgarbowski]

I think people overestimate the potential supply of wealthy owners willing to lose money to build great soccer teams. They exist, to be sure, but how many are there -- especially for a currently second (or third according to some) tier league. MLS TV ratings and revenue are both pitiful. I realize owners in Chicago and other places are notoriously cheap, but I also do not believe that they are making big profits and hoarding the cash. You need people willing to lose money if you are going to pay MLS players significantly more.
Everyone recognizes that we have a chicken/egg problem where MLS cannot grow its audience without better players but also cannot pay for better players with its current audience. I realize that having a bunch of profligate super wealthy owners seems to untie this knot, but I just don't see it happening in enough markets to make a league changing difference.
Add to that -- there is no guarantee that soccer and MLS will grow enough even with better players. The Big 4, plus college FB and BB, plus Nascar, will not inevitably fade, and MLS has to compete with the PL, Bundesliga, etc as well.* And at some point I do think this is a zero sum game. Sports has certainly undergone massive growth in the last 4-5 decades, as the audience grew, as disposable incomes increased, and the industry figured out how to get that audience to spend more and more of that disposable $$.
But the hard limit is not money but time. The audience can keep making more money, but it can't fit more hours in a day or week. You can only spend so much time watching all these sports and if MLS is going to grow I think one or more of the above leagues will have to lose out. We've covered this in the forum earlier: baseball has lost viewers in some key measurements while doing great in others. Hockey always seems poised to falter. Some predict concussions will kill the NFL. Maybe. I don't pretend to know. But I do think that if MLS does rise to a world class league it will come at the expense of one of the above. And it is going to take a change in US sports fan preferences in addition to great players for that to happen. Soccer has been the sport of the rising generation in the US since at least the time of the original Cosmos. Maybe this time for real, but maybe not, too.

*PS: Noting that these sports are boring, or slow, or making fun of their demographic audience, is not an argument.

 

[franchise646]

Why?

Maybe I being overly American about it but I rather our best talent stay here and build this league

 

[Kjbert]

DC doesn't want to pay large wages. I believe they had the lowest payroll in MLS this year. They will never Perry Kitchen what he deserves.

I wish there was a mechanism in MLS that would allow other MLS teams to win the right to pay him a fair salary to block a move to Europe. Unfortunately, it would put him into DP territory. But what if there was something, like the Bird Rule/Rights in the NBA, where you could pay a player like a Kitchen, Yedlin, Powers, etc. into DP territory without having to use up a DP slot?

 

[Ulrich]

I think people overestimate the potential supply of wealthy owners willing to lose money to build great soccer teams. They exist, to be sure, but how many are there -- especially for a currently second (or third according to some) tier league. MLS TV ratings and revenue are both pitiful. I realize owners in Chicago and other places are notoriously cheap, but I also do not believe that they are making big profits and hoarding the cash. You need people willing to lose money if you are going to pay MLS players significantly more.
Everyone recognizes that we have a chicken/egg problem where MLS cannot grow its audience without better players but also cannot pay for better players with its current audience. I realize that having a bunch of profligate super wealthy owners seems to untie this knot, but I just don't see it happening in enough markets to make a league changing difference.
Add to that -- there is no guarantee that soccer and MLS will grow enough even with better players. The Big 4, plus college FB and BB, plus Nascar, will not inevitably fade, and MLS has to compete with the PL, Bundesliga, etc as well.* And at some point I do think this is a zero sum game. Sports has certainly undergone massive growth in the last 4-5 decades, as the audience grew, as disposable incomes increased, and the industry figured out how to get that audience to spend more and more of that disposable $$.
But the hard limit is not money but time. The audience can keep making more money, but it can't fit more hours in a day or week. You can only spend so much time watching all these sports and if MLS is going to grow I think one or more of the above leagues will have to lose out. We've covered this in the forum earlier: baseball has lost viewers in some key measurements while doing great in others. Hockey always seems poised to falter. Some predict concussions will kill the NFL. Maybe. I don't pretend to know. But I do think that if MLS does rise to a world class league it will come at the expense of one of the above. And it is going to take a change in US sports fan preferences in addition to great players for that to happen. Soccer has been the sport of the rising generation in the US since at least the time of the original Cosmos. Maybe this time for real, but maybe not, too.

*PS: Noting that these sports are boring, or slow, or making fun of their demographic audience, is not an argument.

Until teams start reaping the profits from their academies, team owners will either have to tread water regarding profits (so they say), or they will make their cash from selling the club for more than they paid to get in. The really rich owners will wait it out and see a monster return from transfers + the appreciation of the club over a long period of time (like the Rooney family & the Pittsburgh Steelers once they sell). The cheaper owners will see a nice return from flipping the club after a few years (like NYC real estate).

 

[Vito]

But what if there was something, like the Bird Rule/Rights in the NBA, where you could pay a player like a Kitchen, Yedlin, Powers, etc. into DP territory without having to use up a DP slot?

Isn't that what we did with Mix though? He's making $750k and we paid it down with Allocation Money

 

[SayWhat44]

https://twitter.com/x/status/669652435657445377

I doubt there's much to this but I would love it

 

[Ulrich]

Isn't that what we did with Mix though? He's making $750k and we paid it down with Allocation Money

I think it's more that you have a player that's been with your team for a while, and they're due a raise, but under normal circumstances the raise would put you over the cap or limit of DP's. In this case the player could still get the raise but the increase would not a be counted as a DP salary (they'd just count as the max number cap-wise). It'd be like getting an extra DP in the sense that they're paid more than they traditionally could be but its because there's mutual loyalty being shown by both the player and club - i.e. reward, not penalize, the player/club.

 

[Midas Mulligan]

I think people overestimate the potential supply of wealthy owners willing to lose money to build great soccer teams. They exist, to be sure, but how many are there -- especially for a currently second (or third according to some) tier league. MLS TV ratings and revenue are both pitiful. I realize owners in Chicago and other places are notoriously cheap, but I also do not believe that they are making big profits and hoarding the cash. You need people willing to lose money if you are going to pay MLS players significantly more.
Everyone recognizes that we have a chicken/egg problem where MLS cannot grow its audience without better players but also cannot pay for better players with its current audience. I realize that having a bunch of profligate super wealthy owners seems to untie this knot, but I just don't see it happening in enough markets to make a league changing difference.
Add to that -- there is no guarantee that soccer and MLS will grow enough even with better players. The Big 4, plus college FB and BB, plus Nascar, will not inevitably fade, and MLS has to compete with the PL, Bundesliga, etc as well.* And at some point I do think this is a zero sum game. Sports has certainly undergone massive growth in the last 4-5 decades, as the audience grew, as disposable incomes increased, and the industry figured out how to get that audience to spend more and more of that disposable $$.
But the hard limit is not money but time. The audience can keep making more money, but it can't fit more hours in a day or week. You can only spend so much time watching all these sports and if MLS is going to grow I think one or more of the above leagues will have to lose out. We've covered this in the forum earlier: baseball has lost viewers in some key measurements while doing great in others. Hockey always seems poised to falter. Some predict concussions will kill the NFL. Maybe. I don't pretend to know. But I do think that if MLS does rise to a world class league it will come at the expense of one of the above. And it is going to take a change in US sports fan preferences in addition to great players for that to happen. Soccer has been the sport of the rising generation in the US since at least the time of the original Cosmos. Maybe this time for real, but maybe not, too.

*PS: Noting that these sports are boring, or slow, or making fun of their demographic audience, is not an argument.

This is why you use the Euro-friendly tv time strategy.

Did anyone hear the douchecrackers on Best Soccer Show throwing out that strategy on the show this week in response to the poor playoff ratings? I felt wronged that the board, and namely me, weren't credited. MLSinati IS REAL. AND THEY ARE TARGETING US.

 

[EganSoccerWords]

I don't think so. NYCFC & Villa had a contract worked out and MLS told RB they could create a contract to match within 24 hours or they'd forfeit the ability to sign him via discovery. RB was not previously in negotiations and as such they didn't think they could Vet him and get it done that fast - shame on them for claiming a player they weren't prepared to sign by knowing what terms they'd be willing to offer. That's the problem I have with the entire discovery process - if a team claims somebody they most definitely should have the bulk of a contract in place and ready to offer if the player becomes available - tweaking of the contract is normal and shouldn't be the deal-breaker by not having enough time. Regardless, it seems that Villa was more interested in NYCFC anyway - his agent could have easily demanded more time for RB if that's where he wanted to land.

You are right. The issue was that NYCFC shouldn't have entered in negotiations with Villa. I don't know if the whole discovery process can change because that would threaten the single-entity BS.

 

[Ulrich]

You are right. The issue was that NYCFC shouldn't have entered in negotiations with Villa. I don't know if the whole discovery process can change because that would threaten the single-entity BS.

I'm not sure if what NYCFC did is really any different than what took place with Jermaine Jones or Drogba. Both were "governed" by other team's Discovery, but negotiations were going on with the clubs where they ended up before the Discovery option was relinquished. There's no way each player wasn't in contact with the final clubs prior to permission being granted, because the said clubs had to have some reassurance that they'd be successful signing each player before throwing their hat in the ring. Yes, MLS can have the Discovery rules in place, but they know that if it's strictly adhered to, no significant players are going to be willing to come to MLS without say in their destination.... hence the current $50K payoff as a token gesture for being a bridesmaid. Give it a few more years (once current DP contracts end for a bunch of clubs & they have to restock) and the Discovery Process will be resting in its grave - teams like NYCFC, LAG, LA2, Tor, SEA, TeamBeckham will revolt if they have to consistently pay extortion money to sign players that want to play for them (and not others). Make no mistake, those owners will be the ones to strip away MLS' arcane roster rules and streamline the process.

 

[Ulrich]

Maybe I being overly American about it but I rather our best talent stay here and build this league

I'd love for MLS to be able to fully nurture the best American talent, but I think a bunch of returning guys have taken steps back since returning. Michael Bradley looks bad compared to his form when at Roma. Altidore also looks bad - granted he's consistently injured, Dempsey was less of a primadonna when he wasn't top dog on his team. I think the only player that has had a resurgence since coming home has been Sacha Kljestan but I wonder if that's due more to the system RB plays than anything else because on the USMNT he get abused by every opponent.

Frankly, I'm not sure what the answer is since MLS is great at nurturing young talent, but its not great at keeping the tip of the knife sharp. The only thing I can think of is having a more balanced roster so that even the top players (DPs) aren't guaranteed playing time, but to do that would require a salary cap 10-20 times what it is now. Until that happens, MLS may have to be satisfied with US players leaving to get better/mature, then returning for a short/big contract, and then leaving again to get back up to top form and keep their international careers alive.

 

[EganSoccerWords]

Drogba rights were traded from Chicago to Montreal. That never happened with Villa. The league did give RB some allocation hush money but it never came out of NYCFC's pocket.