Problems At Rbny?

MikeDatTiger

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I noticed this blog post from a few days ago about rumblings at RBNY. Money quote from the former general manager:

"All I can say about my departure is we no longer agreed to the strategy," de Bontin said Saturday. "I think I am very ambitious for New York and very ambitious for soccer in this country. The objective that I had did not necessary match those of the Red Bull organization in Austria. I felt it was better with this in mind that we parted ways."

Yowzer. Makes me thankful for the way NYCFC have handled things.
 

einwindir

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I'm not sure what to make of the article. But I don't think that Red Bull is in MLS/Soccer to grow the league or sport. They are in it to have their name associated with xTReMe sPoRTz! Or as the alternative to the big four. They aren't in the soccer business to develop a love for 'the beautiful game'. I know I'm not going against the grain here either....but it's why I never felt truly at home with RB. I mean, come on, their logo is a c/p of the Red Bull logo. Anytime I walked in the arena I felt like a whore.

And I'm no fool, I know all sports fans are a commodity, but at least most team ownerships create a package that appears to be sport/fans first (the NYCFC approach and why they will be more successful than RBNY).
 

Vinjay

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"No longer agreed to the strategy..."

As I've pointed out a few times RB can change their corporate philosophy at any moment. RB are only going to be involved as long as the people at the top of the corporation want to be involved. Stupid people will say the same about NYCFC owners but what are their foundations built on? Promoting their drink and nothing else. How many people at RB actually want the club? If its the owner or a minority it could take one death or a major corporate shift to change the whole thing. Then the question is would they sell or downsize? A sale wouldn't essentially be a bad thing for them especially if they went back to their old name. Wrestling fans only have to look at how WCW imploded once their main advocate (Ted Turner) lost control of his empire.
 

MikeDatTiger

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To me, the real question is considering the marketing approach Red Bull has taken with the club, does Red bull see winning MLS Cups and having full stadiums as essential pieces of marketing their energy drink? Because they've made clear that above all, that's the goal. I'm just not sure it is. Red Bull wants to blow a bunch of money to get their Red Bulls to the top tiers of the sport because they get more marketing that way, but do they need to spend that extra bit of money to get those clubs to the very top? Put another way, is Red Bull going to make back the money they spend on extra talent/development/coaching/marketing the club via extra energy drinks sold?

With this article, the answer seems to be no. Even if you don't like MCFC, I think the answer is clearly that their goals would be served by that extra money spent on NYCFC. That's a huge problem for RBNY.
 

Joename

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I'm not sure what to make of the article. But I don't think that Red Bull is in MLS/Soccer to grow the league or sport. They are in it to have their name associated with xTReMe sPoRTz! Or as the alternative to the big four. They aren't in the soccer business to develop a love for 'the beautiful game'. I know I'm not going against the grain here either....but it's why I never felt truly at home with RB. I mean, come on, their logo is a c/p of the Red Bull logo. Anytime I walked in the arena I felt like a whore.

And I'm no fool, I know all sports fans are a commodity, but at least most team ownerships create a package that appears to be sport/fans first (the NYCFC approach and why they will be more successful than RBNY).

Man, if this doesn't describe my feelings toward RBNY absolutely perfectly. Honestly, if they were still the Metrostars, I'd be totally on board. No city name, like they experimented with before the Red Bull takeover. Just Metrostars. I'd be completely fine with Red Bull being the main sponsor. But the soda being the centerpiece, it's just so tough.

Not to discount their investment in the team. They did build the best stadium in MLS. And brought over Henry and Cahill. It's just such a confusing, disheartening situation.
 
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NYCFCFan10

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I've been screaming Red Bulls are now the Chivas USA of the league and must be dealt the same fate.

Bring in the Cosmos.
 

Joename

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I've been screaming Red Bulls are now the Chivas USA of the league and must be dealt the same fate.

Bring in the Cosmos.

Oh man, how about Cosmos investors taking over RBNY if Red Bull loses interest? That'd be one hell of an interesting situation. Especially for supporters...
 

einwindir

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Oh man, how about Cosmos investors taking over RBNY if Red Bull loses interest? That'd be one hell of an interesting situation. Especially for supporters...
LOL I think you would see a small spike in the suicide rate amongst soccer fans in the Queens/LI area. Those guys are having enough trouble coming to terms with the fact that City would rather build a team from the ground up than buy an NASL team.
 
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NYCFCFan10

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Oh man, how about Cosmos investors taking over RBNY if Red Bull loses interest? That'd be one hell of an interesting situation. Especially for supporters...
I've been hoping that Red Bull would just say alright, let's merge clubs -- Red Bull and Cosmos. Cosmos will be the club name and colors but Red Bull will get shirt sponsorship and the stadium will remain RBA.

Probably the biggest obstacle to this is Cosmos ownership from what I gather. They just don't like MLS's terms. One can only hope that the ownership sells soon to someone more reasonable.
 

NYCFCFan10

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RB U-17 just got demolished by Flamengo 6-1 in the Generation Adidas Cup lol

Game was really closer than that but RB clearly gave up at the end and allowed a bunch of goals.
 

MikeDatTiger

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I've been hoping that Red Bull would just say alright, let's merge clubs -- Red Bull and Cosmos. Cosmos will be the club name and colors but Red Bull will get shirt sponsorship and the stadium will remain RBA.

Probably the biggest obstacle to this is Cosmos ownership from what I gather. They just don't like MLS's terms. One can only hope that the ownership sells soon to someone more reasonable.

Red Bull could always just buy the Cosmos trademarks from the group. The NASL side could just rebrand but stay in the NASL with the terms they prefer + plus the extra cash from the trademark. That strikes me as highly unlikely but it would be an option for Red Bull if they decide to go that route. I don't think Metrostars is a viable name anymore. Even if they rebranded to "New York United" They'd still be known as the "Red Bulls."

Actually, New York United versus New York City has a nice ring to it.
 

NYCFCFan10

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The whole marketing scheme of Red Bull sports clubs seems ass-backwards to me.

Its one thing to be a shirt sponsor or sponsor a nascar/f1/rally car and a completely other thing to start a sports team.

I mean, if ManU started an energy drink line: ManU energy drink. Who would buy it? ManU fans. Who else? Will Liverpool fans buy it? ManC fans? Arsenal?

Its the same thing. Its totally backwards.
 

Andy

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RB is a drink manufacturer using sports to promote their drink.. NY Yankees and Man City are sports organisations providing sports to the public.
You might say that for Yankees and MCFC there´s nowhere to hide if NYCFC doesn´t deliver the goods off and on-pitch, which is why there´s such a focus on the foundation of the club, things simply must be top class in all ways.
 

Yonkers Ultra

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Hello. First time post here. I want to say I have been following the league since its inception, Metro in particular. They were the closest team to where I live so a went to their games and supported them. The problem that they have is that there is an ownership who places an exhibition competition (Arsenal's Emirates Cup) over a real trophy (the U.S. Open Cup) which would have given us a spot in the CONCACAF Champions league. RBNY blew it on that one. In fact for the Emirates Cup they used five of the same starters on one days rest for the final. The organizations priority is to market their product, not the team. The brand Metrostars was not embraced by everyone, but it was our team. Thierry Henry wears the RBNY captain's arm band with the red and black of Metro. He did that after one of the supporters sent him an old Metro jersey. He asked someone in the locker room what the shirt meant and he was told. He gets it. He gets the pain of Caricola's own goal, he gets that fans went out of their way to Giants stadium to cheer this team on. So does Tim Cahill and Juan Pablo Angel. Rumors out of Harrison was that de Bontin wanted the organization to embrace the brand of Metrostars, which 18 years later turns out to be a great name. But they said no and another man who gets it left. Now they bring back Marc de Grandpre. The same man who fired Bruce Arena (two MLS Cups), fired Giovanni Saverese (NASL Cup) and brought RBNY Juan Carlos Osorio (coached the worst record in RBNY team history). The team is on a path to self destruction and as long as RB owns the team, they will have dysfunction.
That is my rant, and I am sticking to it. ~ Y.U.
 
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Andy

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The irony is that if NYRB had embraced NJ as much as the Metrostars tried to do I´m sure they would be a much more solid club.
NYRB is eminently suited to embrace and market themselves as a NJ club and reap the rewards for doing so much like NJDevils have done, but no way RedBull Gmbh will ever acknowledge that NJ exists in connection with their precious energy drink..
 
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Vinjay

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The irony is that if NYRB had embraced NJ as much as the Metrostars tried to do I´m sure they would be a much more solid club.
NYRB is eminently suited to embrace and market themselves as a NJ club and reap the rewards for doing so much like NJDevils have done, but no way RedBull Gmbh will ever acknowledge that NJ exists in connection with their precious energy drink..

I've pointed out that NYCFC should take advantage of that New Jersey market as well. Its something that hasn't really been brought up and understandable that its been overlooked but its a new take on things. Of course promoting NY takes place first and foremost but there should be some advertising dollars sent in NJ's direction. If people feel that would be a waste of money then fine but "thinking big" does not stop just at NY (and that is a hell of a statement considering I regard the entire New York state as a long term catchment area) and to an extent the UK following. Of course there are people on here from Asia and certainly some Melbourne H fans may have an interest. NJ should be that third key marketing area or at least a distant third and certainly far ahead of any no 4.

Don't know about self destruction they might be more prone to a sale (which wouldn't be end of world as there's no reason why they couldn't attract decent owners) or stagnation. After all look at New England and the negativity the Krafts have brought as far as their MLS franchise goes. I certainly don't see them functioning as well off the field as NYCFC. I keep laboring the point about corporate policy shifts but that should be their fans number 1 concern. If the drink loses popularity (not a gigantic amount but significant) where will costs start being cut? Which assets will be potentially offloaded? If they choose to look at the short term and ignore it then that's their problem. People should look a few years down the road. No doubt some RBNY fans who might read this will think its just provocation or imagination running wild but that isn't the case. I don't hate RB but that company should not be trusted and there's countless reasons whether its RB or their other sporting interests. They don't even try to lie about their motives.
 
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Andy

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Red Bulls main sporting investments are in motor racing as well meaning that soccer is a secondary concern..
 

Yonkers Ultra

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IMHO, I think it the sale of the club RBNY would be self destruction. The club would have to be rebranded. Who knows if the new owners want to call the team Metrostars. The team was originally just a NY team but the owners couldn't find venue to play in the state. The league had it's sights on a New Jersey team as well but IIRC , there were no takers. So the league moved them to NJ and labeled them NY/NJ Metrostars so both states would be represented. And that is what RBNY missed as well. Not only do they change the team name, but they bill themselves as a NY team only. They have no idea how to market themselves. Side story, During Marc de Grandpre's first stint at RB, he had the interns dressed in red face paint wearing bull horns and roam through midtown Manhattan. They called this stunt "Running with the bulls". It was a disaster that was mocked by the New England Revs organization. Pretty sad when you know their history. So when I say destruction, it is meant about the relationship with the fan base and the teams identity. Sorry if I sound bitter about this, but I am. It is not a response to anyone's postings on this sight but to the buffoons in Austria.
That's my rant and I'm sticking to it.~Y.U.
 
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MikeDatTiger

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IMHO, I think it the sale of the club RBNY would be self destruction. The club would have to be rebranded. Who knows if the new owners want to call the team Metrostars. The team was originally just a NY team but the owners couldn't find venue to play in the state. The league had it's sights on a New Jersey team as well but IIRC , there were no takers. So the league moved them to NJ and labeled them NY/NJ Metrostars so both states would be represented. And that is what RBNY missed as well. Not only do they change the team name, but they bill themselves as a NY team only. They have no idea how to market themselves. Side story, During Marc de Grandpre's first stint at RB, he had the interns dressed in red face paint wearing bull horns and roam through midtown Manhattan. They called this stunt "Running with the bulls". It was a disaster that was mocked by the New England Revs organization. Pretty sad when you know their history. So when I say destruction, it is meant about the relationship with the fan base and the teams identity. Sorry if I sound bitter about this, but I am. It is not a response to anyone's postings on this sight but to the buffoons in Austria.
That's my rant and I'm sticking to it.~Y.U.
When the revs are making fun of you, it's not a good thing. I ca nt understand why they hired him back other than they were too lazy to do a real search or no one else wanted to work there. Neither is a good thing.

But why do you think a rebrand or sale would be awful?
 

einwindir

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The irony is that if NYRB had embraced NJ as much as the Metrostars tried to do I´m sure they would be a much more solid club.
NYRB is eminently suited to embrace and market themselves as a NJ club and reap the rewards for doing so much like NJDevils have done, but no way RedBull Gmbh will ever acknowledge that NJ exists in connection with their precious energy drink..
That's a really good point. And RB supporters - especially GSU - would have that much more enthusiasm for their team. Don't get me wrong, NJ sucks by all measures but they deserve to have their own team by name...kinda fucked up that the Giants and Jets both use NY despite playinging in NJ.
When the revs are making fun of you, it's not a good thing. I ca nt understand why they hired him back other than they were too lazy to do a real search or no one else wanted to work there. Neither is a good thing.

But why do you think a rebrand or sale would be awful?
It would more than likely devastate fan/brand loyalty. How many times can a fanbase "change their team" before just giving up on the franchise entirely. I wouldn't blame them either. The transition was hard enough from Metrostars to Red Bulls.