What Players Other Than Villa And Mix Are Mls Caliber?

[The Toe]

Its not just about the amount of goals given up. Its about the stupid mistakes, poor marking, and poor overall play of the back line.

Did you see the game last night? Did you hear the color commentator call one of our players actions stupid after an unnecessary blind clearance that almost lead to a goal? Remember in the first half...I forget who it was...but while facing goal with no attackers near him, one of our defenders tried to clear the ball with an over head kick. Of course it went right to the front line of Real Salt Lake, and Saunders had to bail us out yes again.

When I saw that clearance attempt though, I knew it would be a long night. Thats just poor...and lacks awareness. He had all day to turn around and pass the ball or properly clear it...but nope. If it wasnt for Saunders this team would have easily given up twice as many goals.

Of course, but the best you're looking at is a tie if you're playing perfect defense but can't score. At least having a solid offense will give you a puncher's chance. I'd rather win 3-2, knowing we could count on at least 2 goals per game than have a defense that allows 1 per game, and we sit there, praying for a goal. You can't win unless you score. How many DP defenders are out there? A handful?

I'm not entirely sure, though, a simple attacking player will solve anything, and really, a third DP will arrive (hopefully) at the same time as Lamps, making our team identity pretty different. There would be benefits to either, but I think this team would more obviously benefit from an exceptional offensive player than an exceptional defensive player.

 

[NYCFCFan10]

You know, everyone talking about throwing a DP spot to a defender.... We've only given up more than two goals once the whole season. We've scored 2 goals in a game twice. That is atrocious. We're the lowest scoring team in the league. We need more help on offense than we do defense.

Yes, I am NOT a believer in DP defenders. I just don't think you get good value out of it.

Maybe if they add the SuperMax DP spot in the summer, we could add a piece like that.

 

[Drainyoo]

Many will disagree with me, but surrounded by better talent, Grabavoy is absolutely a good MLS player. He's just got shit to interplay with right now.

That's honestly the only one I'm sure on. The only one.

Get off the sauce, buttercup. Surrounded by better talent Grabavoy would look even worse.

 

[Drainyoo]

I think Mullins is, when surrounded by better quality. Saunders has been great at stopping shots, but I think he's far below average elsewhere.

Shelton's one trick has apparently been figured out, so I think he's definitely only a sub at this point.

Everywhere else I look, I see players who are awful. And at every (okay, most every) other team, I see players we could have had that we passed on in favor of these guys.

Some of these guys we play, we gave up assets for.

I think you can possible add Poku to the short list. Granted, we haven't been able to see him play a full 90, but when he does play he seems like he can be a solid MLS level player.

But I agree with you, other than Villa, Mix, and maybe Mullins, the team is a warm pile of shit.

 

[doctorhoosier]

Get off the sauce, buttercup. Surrounded by better talent Grabavoy would look even worse.

Buttercup? How nice of you.

But your statement's honestly just as subjective as mine. And there's a hell of a lot more evidence in Grabavoy's career that he's a quality midfielder, especially in a Kreis system, than there is from this season that he's not. He's being asked to do way too much because we're garbage at at least six spots on the field.

 

[Kouragahio]

I think you can possible add Poku to the short list. Granted, we haven't been able to see him play a full 90, but when he does play he seems like he can be a solid MLS level player.

But I agree with you, other than Villa, Mix, and maybe Mullins, the team is a warm pile of shit.

I don't know how to react to this post. First you completely dismissed a guy who's already started 208 games in the MLS on championship teams and is tied for the lead in assists for us, who also had a monster pre-season, and then you try to convince somebody that a guy who has 123 total minutes, who's our leader in yellow cards per 90 and reckless turnovers and that's really it, oh but if he played 90 minutes he might score 2 goals in 25 games like he did last year for the Atlanta Silverbacks in the NASL? You and me both want to see him out on the field a little more last in games because he brings energy but doctorhoosier is buttercup for that...ok.

 

[PB3]

Wingert is a quality LB, but obviously we've seen that he isn't so good as a CB.

 

[thesauerchise]

A roster FULL of players who have shown success in MLS and we are debating who is MLS caliber? The issue isn't talent, the issue is where they are playing, the formation they are playing, the constant changing lineup and the complete lack of understanding.

If I told you the last names before the season you would not scoff at Wingert, Ballouchy, Grabavoy, Williams, Velasquez, Mullins, Hernandez, etc. They might not be superstars but they would easily make MLS rosters. If Proven MLS players are struggling I do not think its 7 players all losing their ability at the same exact time.

 

[Gavin23]

A roster FULL of players who have shown success in MLS and we are debating who is MLS caliber? The issue isn't talent, the issue is where they are playing, the formation they are playing, the constant changing lineup and the complete lack of understanding.

If I told you the last names before the season you would not scoff at Wingert, Ballouchy, Grabavoy, Williams, Velasquez, Mullins, Hernandez, etc. They might not be superstars but they would easily make MLS rosters. If Proven MLS players are struggling I do not think its 7 players all losing their ability at the same exact time.

"You cant honestly be saying the coaching and or management at fault??? Kreis is a god"

 

[thesauerchise]

"You cant honestly be saying the coaching and or management at fault??? Kreis is a god"

Ha.. I think questions should be asked, though their are many extenuating circumstances.

 

[gbservis]

Hard to stay because he has been hurt but for what we have seen I think Calle is a solid player at LB if he can stay healthy.

 

[JGriff217]

A roster FULL of players who have shown success in MLS and we are debating who is MLS caliber? The issue isn't talent, the issue is where they are playing, the formation they are playing, the constant changing lineup and the complete lack of understanding.

If I told you the last names before the season you would not scoff at Wingert, Ballouchy, Grabavoy, Williams, Velasquez, Mullins, Hernandez, etc. They might not be superstars but they would easily make MLS rosters. If Proven MLS players are struggling I do not think its 7 players all losing their ability at the same exact time.

Define "success." Most of these players were in the expansion draft because they were not one of the 11 players on a team worthy of being protected. To me, if a team believes a player is successful, they would have protected them. We have leftovers on this team. Most of the other teams in the MLS wouldn't take one of our players as a starter, other than our DPs, Saunders and Mix (who has not been impressive). And even those are iffy.

 

[roxfontaine]

Define "success." Most of these players were in the expansion draft because they were not one of the 11 players on a team worthy of being protected. To me, if a team believes a player is successful, they would have protected them. We have leftovers on this team. Most of the other teams in the MLS wouldn't take one of our players as a starter, other than our DPs, Saunders and Mix (who has not been impressive). And even those are iffy.

"Success," as related to the game and this conversation, is being a productive member of a competitive squad. You don't have to be a "star" to have success. These players may not be the go to guys but they had and have some value. That is why they play in MLS and that is why they had and have contracts.

 

[thesauerchise]

Define "success." Most of these players were in the expansion draft because they were not one of the 11 players on a team worthy of being protected. To me, if a team believes a player is successful, they would have protected them. We have leftovers on this team. Most of the other teams in the MLS wouldn't take one of our players as a starter, other than our DPs, Saunders and Mix (who has not been impressive). And even those are iffy.

MLS roster rules make it impossible to simply protect your "best"11. Between the homegrown spots, international slots, designated player slots and the need to cut salaries, the players available in the expansion draft represent a mish mosh of good, bad and indifferent. The nature of expansion drafts, in any sport, is that good players are available.

 

[thesauerchise]

MLS roster rules make it impossible to simply protect your "best"11. Between the homegrown spots, international slots, designated player slots and the need to cut salaries, the players available in the expansion draft represent a mish mosh of good, bad and indifferent. The nature of expansion drafts, in any sport, is that good players are available.

Also what R roxfontaine said about success.

 

[Midas Mulligan]

A roster FULL of players who have shown success in MLS and we are debating who is MLS caliber? The issue isn't talent, the issue is where they are playing, the formation they are playing, the constant changing lineup and the complete lack of understanding.

If I told you the last names before the season you would not scoff at Wingert, Ballouchy, Grabavoy, Williams, Velasquez, Mullins, Hernandez, etc. They might not be superstars but they would easily make MLS rosters. If Proven MLS players are struggling I do not think its 7 players all losing their ability at the same exact time.

Roster full of players who have shown MLS quality (Strike that - even more limiting "success" is the term)? First, I disagree with your premise, as it applies to a mere few of our oldest players. Secondly, I'll disagree with your equating of have shown and "are".

 

[Kouragahio]

I think basically the question is which players would be starters on playoff teams.

 

[thesauerchise]

Roster full of players who have shown MLS quality (Strike that - even more limiting "success" is the term)? First, I disagree with your premise, as it applies to a mere few of our oldest players. Secondly, I'll disagree with your equating of have shown and "are".

I think it is presumptuous to state these players all fell off a cliff. They are playing in new positions, new formations with new teammates and weekly changes. To suggest they lack talent is a reactive opinion that does not take into account all the other variables. Maybe they do, but I think everyone needs more time.

 

[Midas Mulligan]

I think it is presumptuous to state these players all fell off a cliff. They are playing in new positions, new formations with new teammates and weekly changes. To suggest they lack talent is a reactive opinion that does not take into account all the other variables. Maybe they do, but I think everyone needs more time.

Don't disagree that the implementation of tactics and specific deployments are less than ideal, but I feel like I see a ton of individual mistakes. No doubt, we suck the whole way - tactically and individually.

 

[Tom in Fairfield CT]

I think it is presumptuous to state these players all fell off a cliff. They are playing in new positions, new formations with new teammates and weekly changes. To suggest they lack talent is a reactive opinion that does not take into account all the other variables. Maybe they do, but I think everyone needs more time.

Are we basically taking about wingert and grabavoy? Who else has been more than a journeyman? Hernandez? I still think he's been solid.