Official: Sean Johnson to NYCFC

[thesauerchise]

While I'm not ready to anoint Sean John the savior this move does have potentially huge upside. He is 27, which is historically an age where GK haven't hit their prime. He is an exceptional athlete, commanding presence and extensive league experience.

Granted, his one weakness is in possession, though likely is better than Saunders was. Considering his age, and athleticism this can be coached up. His throws are good, though negated slightly if teams know his feet are a weakness and can play to the throw. Good long kicks too. Other concern is some inconsistent positioning but again that is coachable. By many accounts he is a good pro, and will work hard to improve.

At the end of the day this is a move that the long term benefits are yet to be known. There is a reason he was considered a top young US keeper, his talent is real.

I'm willing to bet this ends up a good move, but I certainly can see the opposing view. However, let's give him a bit of time to settle and work on his weaknesses.

 

[LionNYC]

So if Johnson is the starter, we're wasting an international spot on a backup. Is Eirik going to be out the door?

 

[thesauerchise]

While I'm not ready to anoint Sean John the savior this move does have potentially huge upside. He is 27, which is historically an age where GK haven't hit their prime. He is an exceptional athlete, commanding presence and extensive league experience.

Granted, his one weakness is in possession, though likely is better than Saunders was. Considering his age, and athleticism this can be coached up. His throws are good, though negated slightly if teams know his feet are a weakness and can play to the throw. Good long kicks too. Other concern is some inconsistent positioning but again that is coachable. By many accounts he is a good pro, and will work hard to improve.

At the end of the day this is a move that the long term benefits are yet to be known. There is a reason he was considered a top young US keeper, his talent is real.

I'm willing to bet this ends up a good move, but I certainly can see the opposing view. However, let's give him a bit of time to settle and work on his weaknesses.

As for Eirik. I think Sean has a higher ceiling and a better track record currently. While Eirik does the one thing well that Sean doesn't, I'm not sure his ceiling is ultimately "cup winning" level. Plus his positioning is inconsistent as well. I do like Eirik though but again the ceiling for Sean feels noticeable higher.

 

[Davo15]

I thought there'd be more celebrating that Saunders is clearly not going to be our number one next year...

 

[JGarrettLieb]

I thought there'd be more celebrating that Saunders is clearly not going to be our number one next year...

We're too busy fretting over how we can unwind Jason Kreis's roster decisions without getting ripped off.

 

[Kjbert]

I will admit that we have a better chance at winning MLS Cup today than we did yesterday.

How much better depends on the other shoes that drop.

 

[ZYanksRule]

I thought there'd be more celebrating that Saunders is clearly not going to be our number one next year...

Frankly, that was painfully evident the moment he didn't start the playoff games. That's when you knew he wasn't going to be the starter next year.

I love this move. Sean is 27 with a huge amount of potential. The question is, was he made to look worse because of his defense in Chicago, and how much room is there to grow. Still, it's exciting to see the team plugging one of the biggest holes on the roster. Or, at least attempting to. Lots of work still to do this offseason, but this is a good start.

 

[william straiton]

This raises an interesting parallel question: Isn't there a FIFA regulation regarding the number of teams a player can be on in the course of a year? Since MLS holds all contracts of players, does that allow the player to move endlessly within the MLS umbrella? Or since ATL completed a trade, that counts as team #2, and now NYC is team #3?

I believe the limit is three teams (CHI/ATL/NYC) so the SJ saga isn't an issue (right now), but if say an European team came calling next summer (as somebody was earlier dreading/speculating -I forget who, so sorry) then I don't think SJ could go anywhere until this time next year. Is this correct?

They have to actually play for the team for it to count. It also goes on a calendar year. Therefore, we will be his first team next year.

I don't know anything about SJ, so can't say if this is a great deal or not. However, I have seen Johansen in the past and he has never gave me confidence in his ability to make important saves or dominate at crosses. Maybe he has improved, but as with City now, it's madness to play a goalkeeper who's biggest attribute is being good with the ball at his feet.

 

[FootyLovin]

In terms of ranking keepers, these guys are absolutely better than Johnson currently:

Howard, Guzan, Hamid, Robles, Rimando, Frei, Blake, Ousted, Bingham.

A healthy Sean Johnson is better then Rimando, and as good as Hamid IMO. To me no difference. There are only a three of GKs in MLS I would take over Sean John and they are Robles, Ousted, Howard.

Just pulled these two comments for context as lots of claims are being made and no one yet supplying numbers. So here's one go at it - save % comparison with team in paren. Here are players mentioned above.

Howard (COL) 74.0
Hamid (DC) 73.1
Bingham (SJ) 72.6
Robles (NJ) 69.9
Rimando (RSL) 66.4
Frei (SEA) 66.4
Ousted (VAN) 66.3
Blake (PHI) 66.0
Johnson (CHI) 64.2
Guzan N/A

So Johnson is at the bottom of this list. But so is Chicago's back 4. FWIW, here are some other noteworthy points of comparison.

Rowe (LA) 76.4
Gleeson (POR) 73.8
Lampson (CHI) 72.4
Saunders (NYC) 62.0

 

[Tom in Fairfield CT]

Just pulled these two comments for context as lots of claims are being made and no one yet supplying numbers. So here's one go at it - save % comparison with team in paren. Here are players mentioned above.

Howard (COL) 74.0
Hamid (DC) 73.1
Bingham (SJ) 72.6
Robles (NJ) 69.9
Rimando (RSL) 66.4
Frei (SEA) 66.4
Ousted (VAN) 66.3
Blake (PHI) 66.0
Johnson (CHI) 64.2
Guzan N/A

So Johnson is at the bottom of this list. But so is Chicago's back 4. FWIW, here are some other noteworthy points of comparison.

Rowe (LA) 76.4
Gleeson (POR) 73.8
Lampson (CHI) 72.4
Saunders (NYC) 62.0

Those numbers hurt everyone's arguments. Delete them.

 

[Ulrich]

Those numbers hurt everyone's arguments. Delete them.

Except maybe mine

 

[joe]

The figures are what was published at
http://blogs.denverpost.com/rapids/...ed-major-league-soccer-players-union/27671/8/

transfer fees are typically included in the numbers, but I doubt any of these players were obtained with transfer money. That's not to say Garber $$ wasn't used for any of them, but it's a moot point because their value is what their teams are paying them. For us to get SJ, we had to pay the extra $$, so that has to be factored in since we cannot use it on another player.

Not quite apples to apples then. SJ's annual number should be salary plus [(GAM+TAM)/years], not a straight 350.

 

[Tom in Fairfield CT]

Here's from American Soccer Analysis 2016 season predictions: http://www.americansocceranalysis.c...edictions-for-the-2016-season?rq=sean johnson

4. Sean Johnson starts seeing his way out in Chicago - The big question when evaluating Sean Johnson is “How has he developed since when he first entered MLS?” (Besides him winning a Lamborghini, of course.) He continues to look overwhelmed in goal, his communication is more than lacking, he doesn’t radiate confidence when dealing with crosses, shot-stopping and distribution are streaky and… well, you get the idea. Chicago have wisely signed the stellar USL goalkeeper Patrick McLain and ex-Columbus Crew backup Matt Lampson to pressure Johnson for the starting spot. Don’t be surprised if someone not intialled “SJ” ends up with the most starts for Chicago at the end of the year. Johnson’s maximum selling point was about three years ago and he failed to reach the ceiling everyone has been expecting for some time. With a salary of a quarter of a million dollars, he is not only in danger of losing his starting spot, but even a roster spot.

 

[sbrylski]

Here's from American Soccer Analysis 2016 season predictions: http://www.americansocceranalysis.com/home/2016/3/3/mls-goalkeepers-predictions-for-the-2016-season?rq=sean johnson

If you take an "anything is better than Saunders" view, this is a good move.

Objectively, this is a risk with a real downside. It sounds like Johnson has talent, but there is a wide range of potential outcomes here as people are banking on "change of scenery" impacts. At the salary and allocation money we gave up for him, only a portion of that range makes this move good or even "acceptable."

 

[mgarbowski]

Here's from American Soccer Analysis 2016 season predictions: http://www.americansocceranalysis.com/home/2016/3/3/mls-goalkeepers-predictions-for-the-2016-season?rq=sean johnson

That's depressing. Does our coaching staff look at him and think "we can fix him?" Maybe they can, but I'd rather they didn't have to.

 

[Tom in Fairfield CT]

If you take an "anything is better than Saunders" view, this is a good move.

Objectively, this is a risk with a real downside. It sounds like Johnson has talent, but there is a wide range of potential outcomes here as people are banking on "change of scenery" impacts. At the salary and allocation money we gave up for him, only a portion of that range makes this move good or even "acceptable."

That's depressing. Does our coaching staff look at him and think "we can fix him?" Maybe they can, but I'd rather they didn't have to.

I agree, how much of his depressing stats are a result of the team he's played on? A positive may be that we will still be going with Eirik as a second keeper, so even if he doesn't pan out, we are no worse than where we ended 2016. (minus money)

 

[Fantazma]

If you take an "anything is better than Saunders" view, this is a good move.

Objectively, this is a risk with a real downside. It sounds like Johnson has talent, but there is a wide range of potential outcomes here as people are banking on "change of scenery" impacts. At the salary and allocation money we gave up for him, only a portion of that range makes this move good or even "acceptable."

probably means there is no confidence in Johanssen then....they actively went looking for GK ( which was a position i thought needed to be addressed). The one thing that i think can help is that he was still "young" in GK years....so now after being "lost in goal" and "lacks confidence" he has more experience and will see if he can use that for our advantage.

you dont reach your "peak" at 25 or so in GK position.

 

[mgarbowski]

I agree, how much of his depressing stats are a result of the team he's played on? A positive may be that we will still be going with Eirik as a second keeper, so even if he doesn't pan out, we are no worse than where we ended 2016. (minus money)

That woeful team didn't trust him. I can believe our coaching staff is better and can improve him. As bad as Saunders was I admit his distribution and play from the back improved as the season progressed. But just as the Fire brought in new players to compete with SJ, PV has already said that we brought in SJ to compete with EJ, "Competition for places in our squad is important across every position and we believe we've signed a goalkeeper with a huge amount of experience in this league, with his best years still ahead."
http://www.nycfc.com/post/2016/12/11/nycfc-acquires-sean-johnson-atlanta-united

SJ is kind of expensive for a project who we have not decided whether he plays.

 

[Ulrich]

I agree, how much of his depressing stats are a result of the team he's played on? A positive may be that we will still be going with Eirik as a second keeper, so even if he doesn't pan out, we are no worse than where we ended 2016. (minus money)

In a league dictated by a salary cap, minus money is a giant variable.

 

[Tom in Fairfield CT]

That woeful team didn't trust him. I can believe our coaching staff is better and can improve him. As bad as Saunders was I admit his distribution and play from the back improved as the season progressed. But just as the Fire brought in new players to compete with SJ, PV has already said that we brought in SJ to compete with EJ, "Competition for places in our squad is important across every position and we believe we've signed a goalkeeper with a huge amount of experience in this league, with his best years still ahead."
http://www.nycfc.com/post/2016/12/11/nycfc-acquires-sean-johnson-atlanta-united

SJ is kind of expensive for a project who we have not decided whether he plays.

I'm not up on the world market for keepers, but my impression is that a good keeper is a scarce asset. Teams with good keepers will never sell them cheap, so your options are to develop (or draft, in MLS) one (Philly -Blake) or wildly overpay (COL-Howard) (ATL-Guzan). I also think their skill is hard to quantify reliably (keepers with good stats fluctuate year to year, and even Saunders had some good stats at times)

I think, in MLS, you operate under the condition that you don't want to use an int'l spot on a keeper, since USA produces good ones and the position is fickle anyway. So your pool is limited, and out of American keepers, taking a chance on a guy on the worst team in the league, that has been regarded highly in the past, is an overall good risk.