The pride of Manchester
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Oh dear oh dear oh dear.
What are NYCFC doing then?
There's nothing wrong with investment.
Possible Sanctions Against Mcfc?
- Thread starter Vito
- Start date
Oh dear oh dear oh dear.
What are NYCFC doing then?
There's nothing wrong with investment.
It also ignores the fact that Liverpool's net spend was four times greater than City's in the decade prior to the takeover. It was ok back then (and they had cash infusions, as well, just not at our scale) but now it is morally reprehensible that City have done something similar in the eight years afterward (a little less than six times Liverpool's net spend). While we have spent more, it is the same action.
I have never denounced Liverpool for their spending, as I understand all successful clubs do it. Quite literally all of them. So I am not quite sure where other supporters are able to muster the righteous indignation.
The pride of Manchester
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Well said mate.
It was fine when that lot from Trafford & the Scousers were spending their way to the top.
They hate it when someone else does it though.
FFPR now stops competition from smaller clubs, it's not a terrible thing for us as we've
snuck into the party, with the door closing firmly behind us.
Let them all moan, we'll carry on collecting trophies.
Look people. I said that when I was under the impression that FFP did what it said on the tin. I thought that it was going to make things fair for all teams, but I've been educated on this thread since and it seems that FFP is not as equitable as it makes out. I also said I'd welcome sanctions if they were against Liverpool. I could just as easily said that I hate what I see at MCFC, PSG, Chelsea and Liverpool in the past. Personally, I'd love a level financial level playing field in football or at least a step closer to it but it seems FFP isn't it.
This thread is weeks old and you've picked something I said early on in it and thrown it back at me. I'd be gutted if Liverpool were bought up by an incredibly rich investor. I like the journey in football. Building a team and nurturing talent. Tactical guile and careful planning. Most other Reds I'm sure would absolutely love it, as do most Man City fans I'm sure! It's filling your trophy cabinet!
I'm not trying to shit on your club. All I'm saying is that I don't like that about the modern game and that it takes the fun out of it for me, the idea that anyone can be good if they have a bit more money than the rest. I'd prefer football with everything shared equally between each team and where finances weren't a variable. I'm well aware that it's a fantasy, but it's my opinion.
You've got the wrong end of the stick which is understandable. Being Man City fans it looked like I was attacking the foundations your club is now built on so I'm sorry I wasn't clear enough. I just feel that more equality financially could only benefit competition and therefore the enjoyment we derive from the sport. Putting our clubs aside for a second I'm sure that's something we could all agree on.
This thread is weeks old and you've picked something I said early on in it and thrown it back at me. I'd be gutted if Liverpool were bought up by an incredibly rich investor. I like the journey in football. Building a team and nurturing talent. Tactical guile and careful planning. Most other Reds I'm sure would absolutely love it, as do most Man City fans I'm sure! It's filling your trophy cabinet!
I'm not trying to shit on your club. All I'm saying is that I don't like that about the modern game and that it takes the fun out of it for me, the idea that anyone can be good if they have a bit more money than the rest. I'd prefer football with everything shared equally between each team and where finances weren't a variable. I'm well aware that it's a fantasy, but it's my opinion.
You've got the wrong end of the stick which is understandable. Being Man City fans it looked like I was attacking the foundations your club is now built on so I'm sorry I wasn't clear enough. I just feel that more equality financially could only benefit competition and therefore the enjoyment we derive from the sport. Putting our clubs aside for a second I'm sure that's something we could all agree on.
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I respect this post, and enlightened debate, which is why I respond the way that I did. And I never thought you were looking for a fight.
You have to admit, the post we quoted did have a hint of indignation, which is what I wanted to address with my thoughts. If your point is that Liverpool and City are equally to blame for the current state of football in England (that is, the last eight years), and you wish it was different, than I can't really argue against that. I wished it was a more equal playing field when Liverpool, United, Arsenal, and Chelsea were drastically outspending us, too. But, as I said earlier, I never faulted any of them for that investment (I found other things to admonish them for).
My point has been and always will be that Manchester City had significantly less to do with the establishment of the Mansion Party that is the modern game then did the other clubs mentioned above (with addition of Real Madrid, Bayern Munich, Inter, and others); we just decided to come to the soirée at 1 am with the better champagne and start chatting up the guests.
I am with you regarding the creation of legitimate financial constraints that will limit volatility, eliminate highly-leveraged operations, and stop bullying by the elite clubs (even City included, now that we are becoming one).
As someone who enjoys watching the best teams in England, but doesn't necessarily root for any of them. I can't fathom Promotion/Relegation here or the completely open system that the EPL is. This year was considered one of the great seasons of the EPL, but how many teams truly have a shot to win? If its only 6-7 clubs with any shot to do anything and then live five more who have no chance of being relegated or playing in Europe... Why do they play?
I loved that MCFC came with money because at least it added another team to the haves pile instead of have-not pile.
I don't mind the fact that there's no playoffs and that championships can possibly be decided way early, but at least give everyone a fair chance. I don't think FFP is going to help either. Like Major League Baseball though, there's no stopping the salaries from exploding.
I loved that MCFC came with money because at least it added another team to the haves pile instead of have-not pile.
I don't mind the fact that there's no playoffs and that championships can possibly be decided way early, but at least give everyone a fair chance. I don't think FFP is going to help either. Like Major League Baseball though, there's no stopping the salaries from exploding.
Some of these teams go back 100+ years of history. The reason they play is because for clubs like Stoke City beating United for the first time in 30 years will give the fans something to cheer about and write songs about for the next year or two.
When you factor in the enormous history involved with the EPL fans and teams alike play for everything from making it to the EPL for the first time to finishing above mid table for the first time.
When you factor in the enormous history involved with the EPL fans and teams alike play for everything from making it to the EPL for the first time to finishing above mid table for the first time.
Hi... Its not because there is a new Sheriff in town, its because FFP was applied in such a way it could only protect the old order. There is a lot of twaddle spoken about how teams such as Man United, Chelsea, Arsenal etc bring kids through to the EPL.
Look at Arsenal .... Aaron Ramsey (from Cardiff) Theo Walcott (Southampton) Kieron Gibbs (Wimbledon) even players they are "developing now" learnt there trade elsewhere (Joel Campbell) Saspirilla.
United after the "class of 92" can claim very few successes, or at least a low percentage that "made it" to regular first team. They have instead smashed the EPL transfer record several times. Andy Cole, Veron, Ferdinand.
Chelsea ... John Terry came through Lampard (West Ham) Cole (Arsenal) Cahill (Everton)
See http://tomkinstimes.com/2014/01/transfer-records-and-why-they-mata/
I dont want to give the impression we feel the world is against us. But in what other business, and top level sport is a business, is investment prohibited. There are other ways, especially if you claim that FFP is there to protect clubs.
City were forced to sell SWP to Chelsea, because they needed the cash (to survive is a bit strong but...)
I know this might appear defensive, but I just want to try to demonstrate the actual realities of some of the issues we as a club used to face and others still face. Big clubs bully with money to get the best players, even at a young age. MCFC are close to the top table now and the old order are scared. How many more rich men will come in and do a Sheik Mansoor. They have stopped them before they can begin. I feel for other clubs, and our new restrictions may well come to benefit you in New York as our investment (spending) is now curtailed for the time being at least.
So although we have not cheated, indeed goalposts got moved see http://forums.bluemoon-mcfc.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=300980
The end result could help benefit NYCFC.
I may have worded it poorly but what I'm trying to say is that because you guys did what you had to do to compete with the big clubs at the time. Their fans will use that as a way to disminish your accomplishments. Which is why most of them support the ffp crusade against you guys and talk about "buying trophies". We're dealing with hypocrisy too here from red bull and cosmos fans.
I think we're saying the same thing.
And by new sheriff in town, I'm talking about MCFC being the top team now.
I think we're saying the same thing.
And by new sheriff in town, I'm talking about MCFC being the top team now.
Sorry I mis understood your context of New Sherriff.
The English usually use "here cometh the newly instated constable to the dodgy end of the village."
The pride of Manchester
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FFPR is brought in to keep the bigger clubs at the top & diminish competition.
The only clubs making a big profit, enough to buy top players, are Bayern Munich,
Man Utd (scum), Real Madrid, Barcelona etc. & you can only spend what you earn
in profits.
When Manchester City & PSG came along, they moaned like f**k to UEFA to stop it,
as they hate the idea of an open competition because of smaller clubs getting investment.
It's a completely corrupt idea which favours the already rich.
If you support the likes of Nottingham Forrest, Leeds Utd, Sheffield Wednesday,
who are fairly large clubs with a successful past but have underperformed over the
last few decades (like MCFC did pre 2008 take over), with the problem of not making a big
enough profit, you may as well give up. Any decent players they produce will be
snaffled by the big dogs in the EPL & European football & they now cannot rely on investment to level the playing field, because of FFPR.
The whole thing is f***ed & it stinks to high heaven.
The only clubs making a big profit, enough to buy top players, are Bayern Munich,
Man Utd (scum), Real Madrid, Barcelona etc. & you can only spend what you earn
in profits.
When Manchester City & PSG came along, they moaned like f**k to UEFA to stop it,
as they hate the idea of an open competition because of smaller clubs getting investment.
It's a completely corrupt idea which favours the already rich.
If you support the likes of Nottingham Forrest, Leeds Utd, Sheffield Wednesday,
who are fairly large clubs with a successful past but have underperformed over the
last few decades (like MCFC did pre 2008 take over), with the problem of not making a big
enough profit, you may as well give up. Any decent players they produce will be
snaffled by the big dogs in the EPL & European football & they now cannot rely on investment to level the playing field, because of FFPR.
The whole thing is f***ed & it stinks to high heaven.
I always thought of UEFA as more of a General Melchett to our Blackadder.
Aguero93:20
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The original proposal was not bad (it had its issues, though) from all accounts. However, after the G14 got to it, via their representatives at UEFA, the entire structure was changed and all mention of leveraged buyouts and operations was removed, among many other substantive provisions.
It is one of the many reasons it has evolved to the farce that exists today. I actually feel somewhat sorry for Platini as I research more because he is not the most intelligent person, at least in business dealings, and I believe he is a puppet for their aspirations.
Aguero93:20
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He made his bed mate, he can sleep in it, I just hope Dupont's case leads to a new and worthwhile FFP that safeguards smaller clubs.
BlueWolf
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FFP was initially to stop another Portsmouth from happening, which is a good thing. However, FFP has now a completely different beast, and cares little for another Portsmouth from happening (besides which, when are Portsmouth ever likely to see European football again?).
This will be beaten and it will be taken down, and when it does, UEFA will likely be dragged through the courts to claim back fines and lost revenue. It will also be the death of UEFA as we know it today.
This will be beaten and it will be taken down, and when it does, UEFA will likely be dragged through the courts to claim back fines and lost revenue. It will also be the death of UEFA as we know it today.
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