RBNJ Postmatch

[Ulrich]

It's not about his teammates or the back four's shape, it's about the unforced errors he makes over and over again. Whether it's losing markers (1-0), coming up second in the air (2-0; 4-1), inexplicable handballs after giving the ball away (3-0) or just not bothering to track back after losing challenges (4-1), he just completely bottled it yesterday.

It's all well and good reaming out Ethan White (who was awful), but we signed him to be what, our third choice right back? Brillant - who earns four times as much - was supposed to be The Answer. Right now he's an ironically named circus clown. Not sure where your beef's come from - I think we should be expecting a lot more.

Ok, I'll tell you where my beef is coming from... Your analysis is completely flawed and you'd see it if you watched the replay of the goals:

1. White clears the ball out of the back directly to a RB player who immediately pushes it forward. At the same time Brilliant steps up to cut off a pass and White stands there behind BWP - it was his responsibility to take over marking BWP when the CB shifts. Brillant did what he was supposed to do & White did not, twice.

2. Zubar scored the goal but he wasn't Brillant's man. Brillant was goals side of his man who shielded Zubar by getting between the two of them. Whomever was supposed to mark Zubar either lost him or got picked. Not Brillant's fault.

3. Handball. Shit happens.

4. BWPbeat White who was man-marking him on the long kick. That's a bread-&-butter play for a defender. Brillant tracked back to the goal, which is the correct play, not trying to close down BWP because Saunders was already doing that. BWP put the ball between white and the goal post.

I don't care if you don't like Brillant, but if you're going to criticize him, or anybody else on the team, at least get your facts straight.

Edited- for brotherly confusion, thanks H Heatmiser

 

[Heatmiser]

BWP.

SWP did fuck all.

 

[FootyLovin]

I personally would not count Zizzo because he never suited up for us. I would say Meara is the first since he did actually get 1 start for us and participated in fan events (post game autograph signings, etc). However, I wouldn't dismiss the argument that even Meara doesn't count since he was on loan and not technically a player under contract with us.

I wouldn't count Meara. The rivalry wasn't real yet. 1 appearance. Away IIRC.

Now there's heat on the relationship. Whoever goes next is who matters for this convo.

 

[LionNYC]

Out of all of these players, I actually like BWP quite a lot. I followed him very closely when he first came to the red bulls, struggling to break out until he finally go this chance up to with Henry feeding him. I think he is a classic case of a late bloomer. The kid is smart, has a great touch, and I think he is one of the top strikers in this league easily. His attitude is very fair, and matter of fact. He doesn't sensationalize things at all which I like.

Dax is another player I like, and his quotes pre and post game were very fare. So were Sacha's. Its dip shits like Robles, Felipe, and Jesse Marsch of course that really rub me the wrong way. Grella as well.

As far as which which player will go directly from one team to another? I assume you are not counting Ryan Meara and the Sal Zizzo trade?

I honestly don't know. Neither of these teams want to help out each other, I doubt any major deal happens in the near future.

Yeah, not counting Zizzo who never wore an NYCFC. Also not counting Meara who just provided one crappy start for us last year in a loss versus Chicago on the road.

 

[Gene]

It'll be Poku. Book it.

 

[EganSoccerWords]

ugh

• After the rewatch, the most depressing thing was the fact that our two biggest issues, bad defense on the right side, and letting up goals on set pieces basically lost us the game, again.
• Say what you want about Marsch but he won the coaching battle today. His pro wrestling heel routine worked perfectly. They dominated the midfield and possession. Jack Harrison was contained. Villa didn't really have shot opportunities. His team was fired up and performed for a full 90.
• Ethan White fucking sucks but both of those yellow cards were really soft.
• I think RJ Allen played a little to chippy today but I think he is still a great piece to have on this team. He had a really great ball that he crossed to I think it was either Harrison or Lampard that was just a beauty. You can tell that he is a guy that is much improved because that ball was hit with his left foot, whereas last year he would often cross with his right foot on that side.
• We have to do something about this RB situation. If we are continuing to give up set piece goals with White/Hernandez at RB, then we need to move RJ back over and play Diego Martinez at LB. Chanot might be a temporary solution but I think the future is him next to Brilliant at CB, but with Mena's recent pretty good form it will be interesting to see what happens when Vieira adds him to the Mix.
• If Josh comes out like he did on BWP's second goal, he needs to come away with the ball.

 

[FootyLovin]

It'll be Poku. Book it.

Ouch, man. Just ouch.

 

[FootyLovin]

ugh

• After the rewatch, the most depressing thing was the fact that our two biggest issues, bad defense on the right side, and letting up goals on set pieces basically lost us the game, again.
• Say what you want about Marsch but he won the coaching battle today. His pro wrestling heel routine worked perfectly. They dominated the midfield and possession. Jack Harrison was contained. Villa didn't really have shot opportunities. His team was fired up and performed for a full 90.
• Ethan White fucking sucks but both of those yellow cards were really soft.
• I think RJ Allen played a little to chippy today but I think he is still a great piece to have on this team. He had a really great ball that he crossed to I think it was either Harrison or Lampard that was just a beauty. You can tell that he is a guy that is much improved because that ball was hit with his left foot, whereas last year he would often cross with his right foot on that side.
• We have to do something about this RB situation. If we are continuing to give up set piece goals with White/Hernandez at RB, then we need to move RJ back over and play Diego Martinez at LB. Chanot might be a temporary solution but I think the future is him next to Brilliant at CB, but with Mena's recent pretty good form it will be interesting to see what happens when Vieira adds him to the Mix.
• If Josh comes out like he did on BWP's second goal, he needs to come away with the ball.

• I actually think we have made too much of the set piece goal. They set a good pick and executed. That's one of those I say tip your hat. We almost had a nearly identical one on the other end with a pick. We just aren't as good at executing.
• I thought the beautiful RJ pass was with the outside of his right foot. Very impressive either way.
• Not so sure about Marsch winning the coaching battle. I think his team won the execution battle. They made their first clear chance. We missed ours. If it goes the other way the whole game could have changed. Also, as I've said before, our strategy relied on Villa and Jack staying onside. They didn't. If they had we might well be talking about how PV won the coaching battle. But I think that would also be false. Both coaches came in with decent game plans (with the exception of the inclusion of White who I want to root for but consistently puts the defense in a horrible position). NJ just did a better job of executing and making good on their first big chance.
• Totally agree about Josh on the last goal. He went to ground too far away from the ball giving BWP the chance to evade and get around. You've got to stay on your feet or by 100% sure your slide is going to get you to the ball.

 

[EganSoccerWords]

• I actually think we have made too much of the set piece goal. They set a good pick and executed. That's one of those I say tip your hat. We almost had a nearly identical one on the other end with a pick. We just aren't as good at executing.
• I thought the beautiful RJ pass was with the outside of his right foot. Very impressive either way.
• Not so sure about Marsch winning the coaching battle. I think his team won the execution battle. They made their first clear chance. We missed ours. If it goes the other way the whole game could have changed. Also, as I've said before, our strategy relied on Villa and Jack staying onside. They didn't. If they had we might well be talking about how PV won the coaching battle. But I think that would also be false. Both coaches came in with decent game plans (with the exception of the inclusion of White who I want to root for but consistently puts the defense in a horrible position). NJ just did a better job of executing and making good on their first big chance.
• Totally agree about Josh on the last goal. He went to ground too far away from the ball giving BWP the chance to evade and get around. You've got to stay on your feet or by 100% sure your slide is going to get you to the ball.

Is that the only job of a coach? To execute a game plan on the pitch? They dominated possession in our third, and dispossessed us in the midfield constantly. We had less than 40% possession and 5 shots vs. their 60%+ and 13 shots. You are sandbagging it a little with the whole Villa and Jack offsides thing. Not going to make up 3 goals.

 

[Shawn S]

It'll be Poku. Book it.

They can't afford him

 

[ManhattanValley]

Ok, I'll tell you where my beef is coming from... Your analysis is completely flawed and you'd see it if you watched the replay of the goals:

1. White clears the ball out of the back directly to a RB player who immediately pushes it forward. At the same time Brilliant steps up to cut off a pass and White stands there behind BWP - it was his responsibility to take over marking BWP when the CB shifts. Brillant did what he was supposed to do & White did not, twice.

2. Zubar scored the goal but he wasn't Brillant's man. Brillant was goals side of his man who shielded Zubar by getting between the two of them. Whomever was supposed to mark Zubar either lost him or got picked. Not Brillant's fault.

3. Handball. Shit happens.

4. BWPbeat White who was man-marking him on the long kick. That's a bread-&-butter play for a defender. Brillant tracked back to the goal, which is the correct play, not trying to close down BWP because Saunders was already doing that. BWP put the ball between white and the goal post.

I don't care if you don't like Brillant, but if you're going to criticize him, or anybody else on the team, at least get your facts straight.

Edited- for brotherly confusion, thanks H Heatmiser

Trust me man, I watched the replays. And I completely understand there were several occasions when White did him no favors at all. I wasn't asking for a forensic analysis of how much slack we should cut him for each goal, although frankly I'm surprised you think he deserves one (for what it's worth I think you're being remarkably charitable to him on the third and fourth goals). Nothing I've said in the post you've so painstakingly picked over is factually incorrect, but I get that honest people can disagree on how relevant/important moments in the game are.

But that's all beside the point. Brillant is our highest paid CB. He's had some good games this year, but he's also shit the bed several times, including twice already against our biggest rivals. Is that good enough? Is 11 goals in 3 NJRB games worth asking questions over, or do we just slap him on the back and blame it on whichever reserve happened to also be playing that day? I want Brillant to be a success, but his contract is big enough that I've got every right to call him out if he doesn't live up to expectations. Sunday was another example of that, so you'll have to forgive me for sounding the alarm.

 

[Ulrich]

Trust me man, I watched the replays. And I completely understand there were several occasions when White did him no favors at all. I wasn't asking for a forensic analysis of how much slack we should cut him for each goal, although frankly I'm surprised you think he deserves one (for what it's worth I think you're being remarkably charitable to him on the third and fourth goals). Nothing I've said in the post you've so painstakingly picked over is factually incorrect, but I get that honest people can disagree on how relevant/important moments in the game are.

But that's all beside the point. Brillant is our highest paid CB. He's had some good games this year, but he's also shit the bed several times, including twice already against our biggest rivals. Is that good enough? Is 11 goals in 3 NJRB games worth asking questions over, or do we just slap him on the back and blame it on whichever reserve happened to also be playing that day? I want Brillant to be a success, but his contract is big enough that I've got every right to call him out if he doesn't live up to expectations. Sunday was another example of that, so you'll have to forgive me for sounding the alarm.

Charitable??? I'm not being charitable, I'm being realistic regarding what each player is supposed to do in a situation. It's also not a forensic analysis - it's simply watching a video and realizing that:

1. BWP was *not* his man to mark because he was the defender that has to step up to pressure the ball handler.

2. Zubar was *not* his man to mark on the corner kick.

3. Shit does happen in games and I'm not going to crucify him for a handball. That happens to the best of players.

4. BWP was *not* his man to mark.

Blame him for one goal but blaming him for the other is ridiculous, so yes, A LOT of what you wrote is factually incorrect. The only thing you wrote that was correct was the handball and nobody is disputing that. And if you're also now trying to tag him with all 11 goals/3 games then you really do have a vendetta, albeit one that is factually baseless and unnecessary antagonistic.

 

[ManhattanValley]

Charitable??? I'm not being charitable, I'm being realistic regarding what each player is supposed to do in a situation. It's also not a forensic analysis - it's simply watching a video and realizing that:

1. BWP was *not* his man to mark because he was the defender that has to step up to pressure the ball handler.

2. Zubar was *not* his man to mark on the corner kick.

3. Shit does happen in games and I'm not going to crucify him for a handball. That happens to the best of players.

4. BWP was *not* his man to mark.

Blame him for one goal but blaming him for the other is ridiculous, so yes, A LOT of what you wrote is factually incorrect. The only thing you wrote that was correct was the handball and nobody is disputing that. And if you're also now trying to tag him with all 11 goals/3 games then you really do have a vendetta, albeit one that is factually baseless and unnecessary antagonistic.

1. We're just going to have to agree to disagree - I do take your point that he was caught between marking his man and pressuring the ball
2. Never said it was his man, just that he was second to the challenge (which he was)
3. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
4. Again, never said BWP was his man, only that he was (inexplicably!) second to the aerial challenge that freed BWP, and then took his sweet time chasing back

Didn't want to turn this into a dick-waving contest, or a 'Blame Brillant for everything' witch-hunt. Lord knows we have enough of those on here. Just trying to point out that the guy fell way short of expectations on Sunday. Clearly he's got people prepared to fight his corner regardless. Maybe that's a good thing, I dunno.

 

[FootyLovin]

Is that the only job of a coach? To execute a game plan on the pitch? They dominated possession in our third, and dispossessed us in the midfield constantly. We had less than 40% possession and 5 shots vs. their 60%+ and 13 shots. You are sandbagging it a little with the whole Villa and Jack offsides thing. Not going to make up 3 goals.

I think you and I should fight this out like Ulrich and ManhattanValley .

But I can't. Because I agree with you that there was a lot more wrong than just the offsides, including everyone from GK to def to mid to coaches.

I do still think the offsides could have dramatically changed the game. A first goal by Villa. A defensive line that's pushed further back, opening more space in the mid. Etc.

 

[EganSoccerWords]

I think you and I should fight this out like Ulrich and ManhattanValley .

But I can't. Because I agree with you that there was a lot more wrong than just the offsides, including everyone from GK to def to mid to coaches.

I do still think the offsides could have dramatically changed the game. A first goal by Villa. A defensive line that's pushed further back, opening more space in the mid. Etc.

ha we can agree to agree

 

[mgarbowski]

Two men enter.
Two men leave.
Damn that was boring.

 

[BxLio91]

I watched the behind the scenes vid the club posted of the derby and the jersey scum had fans heckling our players in the tunnel. Bush league as hell. Next year, the AC in their locker room should malfunction when they visit at YS.

 

[LionNYC]

I watched the behind the scenes vid the club posted of the derby and the jersey scum had fans heckling our players in the tunnel. Bush league as hell. Next year, the AC in their locker room should malfunction when they visit at YS.

Yeah, I saw those two doctors from New Jersey who I never want surgery from (because there are better doctors and closer ones in the city).

 

[danger]

From the NYT's (rare) MLS/NYCFC coverage: "By the time Vieira was tossed during the water break at the 30th minute, the usually mild-mannered coach had already gone to war with a few Red Bulls fans behind his bench, telling them to 'shut up' while using an expletive."

edit: I also liked the Guardian's characterization of Marsch as a "barking chihuahua"

 

[S1ARK5]

I personally would not count Zizzo because he never suited up for us. I would say Meara is the first since he did actually get 1 start for us and participated in fan events (post game autograph signings, etc). However, I wouldn't dismiss the argument that even Meara doesn't count since he was on loan and not technically a player under contract with us.

I am with you.