Stadium Discussion
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Tyler Durden
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hope it isn't a NJ vs. NY thing, I live in NJ and simply can't support a team named after an energy drink. Nope can't do it.
Davo15
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It's not strictly a NJ V NY thing and hell I'm in CT so maybe I don't know what I'm talking about. In my mind there would be a bit of a thought to connect the Red Bulls and Devils since Newark and Harrison aren't terribly far from one another. I think people crossing over from Jersey to support a New York team will happen but save for the NFL which is a rule unto itself your not likely to find New Yorkers willing to cross over into Jersey to support a team in large numbers.
New Yorkers only care about things that are less than an hour away on the subway. I live in Brooklyn, and I consider The Bronx to be "upstate" and Westchester to be Canada. If I have to get on a Metro North, LI Rail, or other train, I assume I'll need an overnight bag. It's a matter of being too busy with too many things going on to figure out anything other than what you know - the subway.
The long term stadium issue is a real tough nut to crack. There is no doubt that a huge component of the long term success in attendance will be subway access. It really is a big part of what makes the team a New York City team - it is so easy to get to the game and it's a huge part of being a New Yorker. Would the vast majority of 15,000 people get season tickets for a team before the first game ever played in a stadium not designed for soccer without subway access? Why didn't these 15,000 supporters buy season tickets for NYRB when it's just a PATH train away? If you can't get to the game easily it does not feel like it is your Club.
The issue is that there is very little land available for a stadium near subway access anywhere in the City and it seems to me to be prohibitively expensive to have the stadium in Manhattan below 59th Street, where most of the subways converge. City government is hip to the fact that beyond some increased attendance in the neighborhood bars, a new stadium will not really spur any economic development and they will be reluctant to give tax credits. Also, think of the cost to build the stadium for a total of 17 home games plus playoffs each year. Will even a 35,000 seat stadium that consistently sells out support that expense? What will those tickets cost?
There is going to have to be a very creative solution here.
Here are some thoughts although I'm not sure any of them make a lot of sense: Roosevelt Island; a new pier somewhere on the waterfront; a large project somewhere like the development of Lincoln Center - essentially tearing down a neighborhood; parkland.
The solution must be within the City limits.
What do you think? Does anyone have any good ideas?
The issue is that there is very little land available for a stadium near subway access anywhere in the City and it seems to me to be prohibitively expensive to have the stadium in Manhattan below 59th Street, where most of the subways converge. City government is hip to the fact that beyond some increased attendance in the neighborhood bars, a new stadium will not really spur any economic development and they will be reluctant to give tax credits. Also, think of the cost to build the stadium for a total of 17 home games plus playoffs each year. Will even a 35,000 seat stadium that consistently sells out support that expense? What will those tickets cost?
There is going to have to be a very creative solution here.
Here are some thoughts although I'm not sure any of them make a lot of sense: Roosevelt Island; a new pier somewhere on the waterfront; a large project somewhere like the development of Lincoln Center - essentially tearing down a neighborhood; parkland.
The solution must be within the City limits.
What do you think? Does anyone have any good ideas?
I was born in the city and grew up in westchester. my grandmother lived her whole life living within a 5 block area in the Bronx. when we would go get her she would tell the ladies sitting out in front of the building that she was going up to the country. She would also make us stop on the exit ramp so she could pick cicoria
Re: WestSideGuy post
There have been several studies done of potential soccer stadium sites, and to my knowledge, the two lead locations have been: the Flushing Meadows / Corona park site and in the Bronx near Yankee stadium.
The Flushing Meadows / Corona park site got shot-down due to local political opposition, which included the need to take over and replace parkland (someone else inferred, I thought, that the Mets organization also later threw in their opposition to this plan).
The Bronx site included the need to acquire privately-owned land and NYCFC executives did not reach agreement when one of the sellers began to raise demands. Apparently there was not political opposition to this plan so when the land can be sold at fair market value, this seems to still be the front runner of all the options (at least until / if a better option comes along).
I liked the Icahn Stadium site on Randall's island, used primarily for track and field, but with a $10 million donation in 2005 toward its renovation, there appear to be insurmountable regulations as to what can be done with this land at his juncture.
There is more on these and other potential sites earlier in this thread. I don't know how your proposals compare to these other options.
There have been several studies done of potential soccer stadium sites, and to my knowledge, the two lead locations have been: the Flushing Meadows / Corona park site and in the Bronx near Yankee stadium.
The Flushing Meadows / Corona park site got shot-down due to local political opposition, which included the need to take over and replace parkland (someone else inferred, I thought, that the Mets organization also later threw in their opposition to this plan).
The Bronx site included the need to acquire privately-owned land and NYCFC executives did not reach agreement when one of the sellers began to raise demands. Apparently there was not political opposition to this plan so when the land can be sold at fair market value, this seems to still be the front runner of all the options (at least until / if a better option comes along).
I liked the Icahn Stadium site on Randall's island, used primarily for track and field, but with a $10 million donation in 2005 toward its renovation, there appear to be insurmountable regulations as to what can be done with this land at his juncture.
There is more on these and other potential sites earlier in this thread. I don't know how your proposals compare to these other options.
I agree that leaving flexibility for expansion is critical. This is a growing sport, and we don't want to be artificially limited in 2025 by topping off the project at 2015 demand. I grew up with college football and watched Florida's stadium grow from 64,500 to around 95,000 through 3-4 expansions between 1980 and 2010. It is still the same historic venue, and I can still sit in the same seats I did when I was 7, but it also fully meets current needs.
Too many MLS teams have built stadiums that won't serve them in 5-10 years. Seattle and its crowds are not going to be an outlier indefinitely.
Given that we won't have a stadium in place for 3-5 years, I would think we could easily fill 30-35K. We need that to be expandable to 40-45K as a next step.
Florida Field opened in the 1920s as a small bowl seating 20,000 or so. Now, it's the largest stadium in the state. That was done little by little over time as demand warranted.
Randalls island is the depths of hell, its easier to get to RB stadium.
Edit*
Look at electric zoo, it gets ~35k people a day and they have to set up an entire charter bus and ferry system to meet demand and thats WITH ~10k people willing to walk over the bridge back to the subway.
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I still say they should buy out Columbia U. football field and build there, they could give CU a sweetheart lease deal for their football team to use it.
http://www.empireofsoccer.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/Columbia-University-Baker-580x386.jpg
http://facilities.columbia.edu/files_facilities/imce_shared/BakerField.jpg
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...marchingband.jpg/250px-Bigredmarchingband.jpg
Of course, I might be biased living across the street....
http://www.empireofsoccer.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/Columbia-University-Baker-580x386.jpg
http://facilities.columbia.edu/files_facilities/imce_shared/BakerField.jpg
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...marchingband.jpg/250px-Bigredmarchingband.jpg
Of course, I might be biased living across the street....
As incredibly convenient Randall's Island would be for me I agree it would be a disaster.
I had the same thought upthread, (with a similar bias). I'd be more hopeful if Columbia hadn't built a brand new facility there within the last ten years though. Would be terribly wasteful to tear that down. I had wondered whether the area across Broadway from Columbia's facility could be a possibility, too. There are things there, but doesn't look to me like there is too much that people would put up a big fight to save.
At first I though access by car would be the big problem with this location, but the major Deegan is very close, perhaps the parking lots just across the river at Target could be enlarged to accommodate drivers, and perhaps the Broadway bridge could be improved for pedestrian traffic, which it could use anyway.
The chances of this happening are about the same as them tearing down greenwood cemetery for our stadium.
Although... maybe we could just built a platform above the cemetery and sell it like were turning it into a crypt!
The new facility is separate from the football stadium but yeah I think the possibility is slim to none. Wouldn;t be the best for car traffic either, would have to rely on A train, 1 train & Metro North.
This is the most interesting idea I've seen on this thread (apart from the ones that have been publicly considered).I agree, it looks like a lack of vehicle access and parking will probably prevent it from being viable, but who knows. The spot is certainly well served by public transportation.
The current stadium seats 17,000. Looking at the picture on Google Maps, I don't see the space necessary to expand that without building over the adjacent baseball field and/or eliminating the track, but perhaps there is a way to move things around and make it work.
There also isn't much of a commercial neighborhood around the site. I would think we'd want a spot where there are pubs and restaurants nearby.
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Had a vision of a quiet reserved funeral being performed and in the moment of quiet reflection a goal being scored and a massive cheer going up.
the sound of subway doors closing would take on a whole new meaning
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