Stadium Discussion

[Statler]

Moving the stadium out of the area it is currently in is a risk not worth taking. The current location is a proven success, although queens may also be a success there is some uncertainty and risk there. We know the Bronx works based on attendance numbers so far, no need to mess with that. I would expect FO does everything possible to build in the same vicinity.

Yankee Stadium does NOT work. It's fine for a stopgap, but after the recent incidents with Securitas, perhaps not even that.

If you're arguing that a SSS makes sense near Yankee Stadium, that's fine. It's not my first choice, but to your point, the location works for a large group.

The right spot in Queens (Flushing Meadows, Sunnyside yards, LIC) would obviously be able to draw. While it is conjecture, you could make the argument it would draw better, as Queens/LI has more population than Bronx/Westchster/Rockland/Fairfield, by a wide margin.

All of that is meaningless though. The spot that ultimately gets chosen will come down to the availability of land, cost, navigating the politics, and the transportation infrastructure (existing or developed). That hasn't been the Bronx so far, but it hasn't been anywhere else either.

The only actual iron in the fire (publicly known) at this point is Inwood. Even worse than YS for those in Brooklyn, Queens, LI and lower Manhattan, and better only for those in Washington Heights, the Northwest Bronx, and folks on the Hudson M.N. line. I'm really hoping that one doesn't come to fruition. I could actually get to RBA easier. Not that I ever would, but it's a disgusting thought that RBA would be closer than City's stadium in the boroughs.

ETA: Clarified paragraph 3.

 

[Statler]

I took a minute and looked at the Sunnyside train yards when I passed by - there's no way a stadium is gonna fit there. But if it did, I would do backflips. Then when the construction and drunken arseholes annoyed me I'd turn NIMBY.

Highly doubt it would ever come to fruition, but not for lack of space. If they built over the rails like the Pacific Park/Atlantic Yards project, they'd have space for one of the largest stadiums in MLS and training grounds as well. Sunnyside Yards has over 160 acres.

 

[Trone]

Yankee Stadium does NOT work. It's fine for a stopgap, but after the recent incidents with Securitas, perhaps not even that.

If you're arguing that a SSS makes sense near Yankee Stadium, that's fine. It's not my first choice, but to your point, the location works for a large group.

The right spot in Queens (Flushing Meadows, Sunnyside yards, LIC) would obviously be able to draw as well, arguably better.

All of that is meaningless though. The spot that ultimately gets chosen will come down to the availability of land, cost, navigating the politics, and the transportation infrastructure (existing or developed). That hasn't been the Bronx so far, but it hasn't been anywhere else either.

The only actual iron in the fire (publicly known) at this point is Inwood. Even worse than YS for those in Brooklyn, Queens, LI and lower Manhattan, and better only for those in Washington Heights, the Northwest Bronx, and folks on the Hudson M.N. line. I'm really hoping that one doesn't come to fruition. I could actually get to RBA easier. Not that I ever would, but it's a disgusting thought that RBA would be closer than City's stadium in the boroughs.

thats the thing, its not obvious that it would draw better, there is a level of unknown there. Yankee Stadium area is proven to work already. Just makes sense to stick with what works and not add any variables into the equation. Im not saying another location wouldnt work im just saying the preference has to be to stick with what already works

 

[AndreT_NY]

usually #1

Post season game 2012.

 

[DeGrozz]

As Adam pointed out, there IS a train for those in Westchester to Citi. It's a long ride, but it's equivalent to what we have now with LIRR to Yankee Stadium.

Those MetroNorth monthly riders can still use their passes, they just need to pay the subway fare from GCP to Willets Point. Not a lot of grounds for bellyaching, since LIRR riders are in the same circumstance now.

Of course, from the club/FO perspective, there's a pretty huge difference between making the stadium more accessible to LIRR riders:

Nassau/Suffolk population 2.9 M
Westchester/Rockland 1.3 M

Fairfield County (guessing a population of about 1M) is also pretty accessible to Yankee Stadium by car and train -- no matter where you put the stadium though, there will be a large contingent that has to take two trains in.

My biggest concern is that if the stadium is moved out to the suggested Queens areas, the social aspect of supporting the team will drop off. There are enough bars around YS to accommodate thousands of fans. You won't get that many other places. Even Citi field seems to be lacking entertainment outside of the stadium (though I admit, I only go to about 1 Met game a year).

 

[adam]

Fairfield County (guessing a population of about 1M) is also pretty accessible to Yankee Stadium by car and train -- no matter where you put the stadium though, there will be a large contingent that has to take two trains in.

My biggest concern is that if the stadium is moved out to the suggested Queens areas, the social aspect of supporting the team will drop off. There are enough bars around YS to accommodate thousands of fans. You won't get that many other places. Even Citi field seems to be lacking entertainment outside of the stadium (though I admit, I only go to about 1 Met game a year).

I'll have to disagree there. The social aspect will change. The supporters will congrigate in the Parking Lots where NYPD won't be looking to arrest anyone from forming a crowd. Interaction between supporters groups will grow, since they each won't be penned up in their own 'home bars'. We can have large crowds, lots of singing, drumming and chanting. And if each supporters group can organize their own kegs, lots of drinking for a lot more reasonable a price. Forza Tailgating!

 

[DeGrozz]

I'll have to disagree there. The social aspect will change. The supporters will congrigate in the Parking Lots where NYPD won't be looking to arrest anyone from forming a crowd. Interaction between supporters groups will grow, since they each won't be penned up in their own 'home bars'. We can have large crowds, lots of singing, drumming and chanting. And if each supporters group can organize their own kegs, lots of drinking for a lot more reasonable a price. Forza Tailgating!

I know each stadium option will be a little different, but the space by Citi Field being mentioned (which is where I'm guessing the tailgating will be) in the post I responded to does not allow for tailgating.

I was drinking with a friend (beer from a can) before a game and another fan warned me that the cops will cite you 100% of the time if they see you with a bottle or can. He said they're much more lenient if you have a Solo cup. I don't know how they'd act if people were getting rowdy. I rarely go to that stadium, so that is just hear-say, but the Met's also say outdoor alcohol is banned on their website:

http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/nym/ballpark/information/index.jsp?content=guide

To be honest, I don't know if drinking in Yankees lots before games is permissible (it may vary by lot), but I've done it plenty of times and never had an issue with it.

 

[AndreT_NY]

I was drinking with a friend (beer from a can) before a game and another fan warned me that the cops will cite you 100% of the time if they see you with a bottle or can. He said they're much more lenient if you have a Solo cup.

Those laws are applicable across the whole city not merely at Citifield. No one messes with you with regard to solo cup unless you are obviously underage. Been tailgating at Citi for years and Shea before that.

 

[adam]

I know each stadium option will be a little different, but the space by Citi Field being mentioned (which is where I'm guessing the tailgating will be) in the post I responded to does not allow for tailgating.

I was drinking with a friend (beer from a can) before a game and another fan warned me that the cops will cite you 100% of the time if they see you with a bottle or can. He said they're much more lenient if you have a Solo cup. I don't know how they'd act if people were getting rowdy. I rarely go to that stadium, so that is just hear-say, but the Met's also say outdoor alcohol is banned on their website:

http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/nym/ballpark/information/index.jsp?content=guide

To be honest, I don't know if drinking in Yankees lots before games is permissible (it may vary by lot), but I've done it plenty of times and never had an issue with it.

Both places and any lot I've tailgates have the same rule. Just bring solo cups and you're fine.

 

[NickA]

Nobody's stopping you. I hear they even have a soccer team waiting...

You're right, no one does stop me. That's the beauty of it. I can go wherever the F' I want. Queens is a pain in the ass from Manhattan. I'm going to see PSG/Fiorentina and RB/Chelsea in Jersey...you think I give a crap that it's not in NYC? Nah. Just wanna see good soccer.

For the record. I've been to a lot of Metro/Red Bulls games throughout the years and never really got that worked up that they played in NJ. I was perfectly fine that there was at least decent soccer in the area.

 

[thesauerchise]

Those laws are applicable across the whole city not merely at Citifield. No one messes with you with regard to solo cup unless you are obviously underage. Been tailgating at Citi for years and Shea before that.

I got an open container at old Yankee stadium, cops told me the same thing.

 

[Buckley]

It will be right next to YS and all will be well

 

[Midas Mulligan]

It will be right next to YS and all will be well

Takes a tough man to make such a tender forecast. 3 times there, Peter.

 

[ldent42]

Highly doubt it would ever come to fruition, but not for lack of space. If they built over the rails like the Pacific Park/Atlantic Yards project, they'd have space for one of the largest stadiums in MLS and training grounds as well. Sunnyside Yards has over 160 acres.

Those acres aren't stadium shaped. It's more river shaped. Maybe if they knocked out the 35th st bridge, which they just reopened to the public a few years ago. There's some train buildings there though so I dunno exactly how high they'd have to build the platform or if they'd knock those down too. I'm not in the architecture/building/construction field. They'd have to then put in multi level parking on either side. And that's all it would fit. JUST the SSS and parking.

Full disclosure: I live across the street from this site. Again, backflips if they build here. But when DiBlasio out of nowhere decided to mention building "affordable housing" in that exact location Van Bramer and that lady who's name I can't remember went nuts. For a SSS I don't know how they'd react. The issue I'm seeing is that nothing is allowed to be built without strings attached. They might not green light a SSS and Parking - but if they add in some hotels or a a convention center they would. Everything has to be a "complex" and include affordable housing or local jobs to get approved.

I also suspect that they are on their way to putting a LIRR station in there. There's a new building with a LIRR work sign on 39th st. If my suspicions are correct it'd be even better for getting fans to the stadium but it might make it more complicated for them to build there.

/end_rant

 

[Seth]

I also suspect that they are on their way to putting a LIRR station in there. There's a new building with a LIRR work sign on 39th st. If my suspicions are correct it'd be even better for getting fans to the stadium but it might make it more complicated for them to build there.

I think that construction is part of the link to get LIRR trains into Grand Central Terminal. I think they're sending trains around the Sunnyside Yard and into the 63rd Street tunnel to a new level of Grand Central to link Metro North and the LIRR.

Which by the way might be an easy way for northerners to get to the Flushing stadium if they decide to build there. Just sayin'

 

[Keith Putnam]

Queens is a pain in the ass from Manhattan.

Yeah, if only you had more subway options than the N,R,F,M,E and 7 trains.

 

[LionNYC]

http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/artic...ew-stadium-project-announce-increase-capacity

Have to applaud Orlando City on this announcement. The full stadium will be now 100% privately financed so the stadium will be owned and operated by the club so they have full control not the city. They'll be buying public land so it becomes private. Also expanding capacity to 25,000-28,000 rather than 19,000.

We have to step it up.

 

[NYCFC_Dan]

http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/artic...ew-stadium-project-announce-increase-capacity

Have to applaud Orlando City on this announcement. The full stadium will be now 100% privately financed so the stadium will be owned and operated by the club so they have full control not the city. They'll be buying public land so it becomes private. Also expanding capacity to 25,000-28,000 rather than 19,000.

We have to step it up.

Bit off topic but in line with us needing a stadium ASAP. Please keep this to NYCFC news/rumors/discussion only.

 

[FootyLovin]

YS area vs. CITI area

YS area
* Track record of success.
* Convenient for bronx, northern manhattan, points north.
* Comfortable choice.
* No competition.
* Lots of bars surrounding stadium.
* Trouble with the PO-lice.

CITI area
* Tap into most ethnically diverse population on the planet.
* Large populations in Nassau/Suffolk relative to Westchester/Rockland.
* Cosmos claiming they will build 25k seat stadium in Elmont possibly drawing fans away.
* Convenient for queens, long island, brooklyn.
* Strains the relationship between yankees/mets egos. (Side rant: How can anyone still watch baseball - a game that in the last 20 years has added no more innings/outs but has lengthened its games by over an hour?)
* Possibility of parking lot partying pre and post game.

Both
* Convenient for some. Inconvenient for others.
* Make some happy. Make some sad.

Bottomline
None of that matters. If there is an acceptable space that opens up in either area, the deal will be done. Problem is doing these deals in NY faces more obstacles than in LA or Orlando or any other space-rich location. NY is just different. My guess: the first space that can be done, will be done.

 

[LionNYC]

YS area vs. CITI area

YS area
* Track record of success.
* Convenient for bronx, northern manhattan, points north.
* Comfortable choice.
* No competition.
* Lots of bars surrounding stadium.
* Trouble with the PO-lice.

CITI area
* Tap into most ethnically diverse population on the planet.
* Large populations in Nassau/Suffolk relative to Westchester/Rockland.
* Cosmos claiming they will build 25k seat stadium in Elmont possibly drawing fans away.
* Convenient for queens, long island, brooklyn.
* Strains the relationship between yankees/mets egos. (Side rant: How can anyone still watch baseball - a game that in the last 20 years has added no more innings/outs but has lengthened its games by over an hour?)
* Possibility of parking lot partying pre and post game.

Both
* Convenient for some. Inconvenient for others.
* Make some happy. Make some sad.

Bottomline
None of that matters. If there is an acceptable space that opens up in either area, the deal will be done. Problem is doing these deals in NY faces more obstacles than in LA or Orlando or any other space-rich location. NY is just different. My guess: the first space that can be done, will be done.

I really don't want us to be next to the Mets, I feel their history of failure and collapses will drift into the stadium next door. We want an MLS within 20 years.