2025 Roster and Transfer Discussion Thread
- Thread starter LionNYC
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It sounds very plausible to me. Claudio had a new job as soon as he wanted one so there was no reason for him to allow CFG to play their games. If Lee is the next fall guy, he will be back in England doing interviews shilling for jobs right alongside Cushing.
ZYanksRule
Registered
Counterpoint: If CFG runs all our big moves, how did they allow David Lee to fire Cushing and replace him with a non-CFG coach?
I think signings like Jovan are "suggested" by CFG, but I also think David Lee and the sporting department largely has full say over the roster. If CFG buys a player and wants to send him here, they can do it but usually those players are good here.
Jovan is an example of one that didn't work out, but many of those types of players do work out.
I think signings like Jovan are "suggested" by CFG, but I also think David Lee and the sporting department largely has full say over the roster. If CFG buys a player and wants to send him here, they can do it but usually those players are good here.
Jovan is an example of one that didn't work out, but many of those types of players do work out.
I would be surprised if both Murray and Prince wind up on the first team roster this year. Murray just converted to CB, and Prince qualifies this season as an off book HG. I would bet that one backs up Risa and the other winds up on the IIs.
Set aside all the personal issues with Jovan. He didn't fit our style of play in any way. How does anyone with $8.5M to spend and a worldwide scouting network look at needs to NYCFC at the end of last season and decide Jovan is the guy?
Also, why do you think it was Lee who fired Cushing? It's just as plausible that CFG fired Cushing because in their opinion they spent a bunch of money on highly regarded talent and Cushing didn't get anything out of them. If Lee isn't calling the shots on the signings I doubt he's the final say on the coach either. CFG hired Pascal because he has a rep for developing players and winning with young teams.
I have a hard time believing Lee is a complete and rudderless figure head. Maybe he has more control on filling in other areas of the roster? Like Hannes and Birk. I always felt like with the CFG network it was a give and take, you get one of the best scouting networks to fill in valuable pieces of your roster, but you also have to be take whom is sent from CFG brass which are their potential diamonds in the rough too. Jovan felt like someone else’s investment that didn’t pay off. Someone saw his rawness and thought they could buy him and flip him for profit without real thought about system or style of the CFG club he would be sent to.
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I think he was 100% foisted on us and his value was inflated to shift money to Yokohama resulting in him being a DP.
Yokohama paid $1.98M to get Martins from Palmeiras in Febuary 2020. We then paid $4M for him 2 years later making him the 10th highest outgoing transfer in J1 League history. How did his value double in 2 years of play in Japan, in a league ranked well below MLS internationally? He wasn't a young prospect any more at 27 when he joined NYCFC. We have seen him play, he's decent but he's not Europe quality, who were we even competing against? Where did the $4M valuation even come from?
Not everything has to be a CFG conspiracy. Tape on Jovan was very good, but sometimes young players are not mature enough to handle life away from home for the first time. It's a risk when you deal with young players. Seems like we are moving on in quick a sensible fashion while still seeking a return on our investment.
I agree it’s a lot of fishiness. And honestly I wouldn’t care much at all if we weren’t a salary capped league. But because we are this cfg accounting doesn’t work well with regards to our team
That's a great point. I could never see how Thiago was worth a DP contract.
Or he just got off on an incredibly wrong foot and simply wasn't able to recover. Maybe if he had gotten here with the others and locked in early, it would have been a different story. It's hard to know based on just 271 MLS minutes.
And it's worth noting, both Trapito and Julian got a look and eventually saw their playing time dry up. I think Ojeda was even subbed off at the half three times after starting.
So, it's possible Nick just didn't want to play any of them. That can be pretty discouraging if you think (or were told) you were being signed to contribute right away.
shouldn’t the intern be a suit by now?
ZYanksRule
Registered
One more point on this:
On the biggest of signings, the owner is ALWAYS the man making the final decision. When Juan Soto was signed by the Mets this offseason, he was negotiating with Steve Cohen and Hal Steinbrenner, not with Brian Cashman or David Stearns. When the Yankees re-signed Aaron Judge, it was Hal Steinbrenner who closed the deal, not Brian Cashman.
The idea that the owner is involved in the biggest deals is very commonplace around American sports. There's nothing to be conspiratorial about here. CFG is the final point-person approval on the biggest deals and highest-spending players, David Lee is the final point-person on the rest of the roster.
On the biggest of signings, the owner is ALWAYS the man making the final decision. When Juan Soto was signed by the Mets this offseason, he was negotiating with Steve Cohen and Hal Steinbrenner, not with Brian Cashman or David Stearns. When the Yankees re-signed Aaron Judge, it was Hal Steinbrenner who closed the deal, not Brian Cashman.
The idea that the owner is involved in the biggest deals is very commonplace around American sports. There's nothing to be conspiratorial about here. CFG is the final point-person approval on the biggest deals and highest-spending players, David Lee is the final point-person on the rest of the roster.
Yes but the difference is Steve Cohen's and Hal Steinbrenner's only priority is the success of the Mets or Yankees.
Yes, CFG wants to win but they also want other stuff for broader CFG too. When CFG does things like they did with Jovan or Martins and the other big mls clubs are only focused on what's best for their team NYCFC is at a disadvantage. That's the problem IMO.
This is the point, I think.
I don't think Lee has zero autonomy; nor do I believe CFG ignores club needs. But I do think club need is too low as a priority, because they believe they are properly balancing club need with the desire to develop and sell, but they are not as good at it as they think. Which effectively , if unintentionally, downplays club need.
I do believe the U22 initiative has seduced them into an imbalanced approach to offensive roster building. The most consistent potential upside is with very young, unproven offensive talent. When you hit, you make more profit than with defenders or from players who were already proven before you get them.
There is not one player on our roster who scored 10 goals in a year at a pro level before coming to NY. I don't think we've obtained a proven 10 goal scorer since Mitrita and Heber in 2019, six years ago. That's a choice you make when you're really good at identifying which young talent will develop, and their record is not as good as their self-regard. Taty, Pereira, Martinez, with Santi in the netherworld* against everyone else. Pereira was only a financial success. He didn't stay long enough to do anything significantly positive for the club, scoring 14 goals in 2 years, which is nice enough but not major. He mostly showed enough to get paid by someone else.
* Santi is tough to judge. He came, was good but not great, tried to leave, returned immediately because nobody wanted him at his or our price, so we overpaid, and he finally shone in his 4th year but is still just an adequate DP. By no means is he a failure. In fact he's our most successful current DP. The problem is our best DP should be better than Santi. Santi ranked 21st in MLS for combined Goals and Assists in 2024. That's not terrible! But it means roughly 2/3 of MLS clubs probably had someone better, accounting for some teams having >1 in the top 20.
I guess somebody has to lead the bottom third, but this club should be better.
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Thiago Martins contract was structured to be able to be bought down, but MLS changed the rules on how buy downs work and we got screwed.
So assuming we do have some room (DP, U22), what do we actually want?
Current XI
Martinez
Ojeda? - Santi - Wolf
Haak - Perea
KOT - Risa - Martins - Tayvon
Freese
Super sub - Maxi
If we use our DP, where do we get the best value over replacement?
(A) 9 - get a super striker on the concern that 2024 was a flash in the pan for Alonso
(B) LW - whether Ojeda or otherwise there is no obvious choice there if Maxi is the super sub and Santi moves to the 10
(C) 10 - move Santi permanently to the LW with a bona fide CAM to run the show and follow Maxi’s legacy
(D) RW - is Wolf better or worse than the wild swings we’ve made in judging him
(E) NOTA - none of the above; let’s spend another DP below the offensive line
Current XI
Martinez
Ojeda? - Santi - Wolf
Haak - Perea
KOT - Risa - Martins - Tayvon
Freese
Super sub - Maxi
If we use our DP, where do we get the best value over replacement?
(A) 9 - get a super striker on the concern that 2024 was a flash in the pan for Alonso
(B) LW - whether Ojeda or otherwise there is no obvious choice there if Maxi is the super sub and Santi moves to the 10
(C) 10 - move Santi permanently to the LW with a bona fide CAM to run the show and follow Maxi’s legacy
(D) RW - is Wolf better or worse than the wild swings we’ve made in judging him
(E) NOTA - none of the above; let’s spend another DP below the offensive line
Still doesn't explain why his fee doubled over 2 years after his transfer from Brazil to Japan, at the far past prospect age of 27.
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If we play a similar formation to last year with a ST, 2 wingers, and a CAM I think the DP should be a CAM elite creator type, ideally similar to Maxi when he arrived or Foresberg. If Pascal plays the 4-3-3 he played at AZ, we don't really need a CAM as the write-ups make it sound like that system uses 3 true midfielders (One attacking but still plays D, 1 holding D type, and one true #8 box to box guy). In that scenario, we need a DP CM that plays slightly more D than Maxi but can still score goals and run the offense.
Regardless of formation, I think DP money is best spent on a creator to pull the strings and put all these young attackers in good spots to see which ones can start scoring some goals.
Lots of interesting questions if we play the 4-3-3 though. How much D does the "attacking CM need to play? Can Maxi or Santi play that attacking CM spot? Will Keaton play enough D to fill the box-to box role, or does he fit only in the attacking spot? Outside of Haak who plays enough defense to fill the more holding CDM type spot? The preseason will be very interesting.
