NYCFC Confirm Departure of PV. Nice Confirm Arrival of PV as Manager.
- Thread starter JayH
- Start date
NYCFC played 437 consecutive minutes of elimination soccer without managing a single goal, all against teams who were worse than us by regular season record or in a lower division, and who also had to play mid-week. In fact, in both playoff series, we played on rest against a team that played midweek. Those teams managed 12 goals in those 437 minutes. Winning the final 103 minutes 3-1 managed to create suspense and positive feelings in an elimination contest for the first time, but nothing more. It was an improvement only because everything previous was so horrid.
NYCFC did not just lose. It failed in spectacular, repeated fashion. I don't see how it is possible to overstate that. Four hundred thirty-seven consecutive scoreless minutes in elimination play. 4.87 consecutive scoreless games.
I get there were holes in the roster. This is MLS. I'm not saying he won't be a great coach in a non-playoff league. He might even have learned from his failures here and become a good Cup competition coach in Europe. If he stays, he might have success in elimination competition in the future. But to date, he has not been remotely good here where it matters most.
The difference in roster quality between the top 4 in the EPL (really it’s MCFC and the other 3 all equal in different ways) and the other CL teams is very little (save for maybe Barcelona and Real Madrid). I’d wager that any of the top 4 EPL teams would have made the CL final if they had Klopp as their manager (same squads). His mastery of getting his players to run through brick walls for big matches is the difference.
Patrick Vieira doesn’t currently possess that quality and he may never have it.
I decided to wait outside the team hotel in Houston, I was also staying in that hotel, for the team bus to arrive after the match with the other traveling supporters. Vieira was the last to leave the bus, he signed an Arsenal picture for a fan. Then I was next, he recognized me, thank me for my support. Now I can’t remember if he said thank you for all your support. But I’m getting the looming feeling that he’s out.
PV will leave after he loses the Open Cup game to RBNJ, just to kick everyone in the teeth one more time.
He didn’t offer you a hand written thank you card embossed with the melted wax Vieira seal?
Preach.
I get the feeling that the team never reaches the same level of intensity in big games - the playoffs, RBNJ games, the game where they got blown out by Toronto and basically conceded the Shield, etc. NYCFC is great at picking up points where they should. But run up against a coach who can gameplan and/or presses and PV is schooled. And more concerning, it doesn’t seem to be changing anytime soon.
He didn’t say he was quite really pleased with your support? Oh he’s gone then.
Oh fuck, if I never get the opportunity to ask him about quite really pleased I’m going to be kicking myself until our next manager comes in with his sayings.
I get the feeling that CFG, while they’d like to win all the hardware possible, are content with being in the top echelon of the league, and not having to break the bank with transfers (like Atlanta). Win the majority of the matches, make the playoffs, stage tons of player appearances, and they probably think that’s enough to keep the fans happy.
They have cut back on the amount of money that goes towards the roster, and K Kjbert seems to think per his sources that is the new strategy, their training facility is satisfactory but can not compare to the glitz of the other new venues recently opened, and when they went to replace Kreis, they brought in Vieira who had zero 1st team experience and he was to gain it here; which he has but also has exposed his weaknesses - and this move is also contrary to ATL who went all in on a proven manager that has more cache and a higher ceiling of tactical knowledge, and is leading the league in his second year.
With all that said, I’m afraid that CFG just wont do any more than the bare minimum necessary. Who they replace Vieira with, coupled with the quality of summer signings, topped off with the DP(s) brought in next year will cement how serious they are for the long term success of winning vs simply competing with the top group of teams. If they skimp on any of those, then they’re not willing to go all in with what needs to be done.
I'm withholding judgment on this, as it seems you are (though leaning negative). But if it's right, I think it is very much a function of how disruptive Arthur Blank has been. When CFG paid the expansion fee and planned out their spending, I think it is likely they expected to exceed all norms of MLS investment.
In fairness to PV, he would never go out drinking and singing with supporters after losing a Cup Final. PV isn't happy with just being there. He actually wants to win.
We don't know that since we never made a Final.
I can’t say that I’ll be quite really disappointed if he leaves.
Our teams the last three years were built with David Villa literally as our only source of offense. It can't be surprising that the better teams with better coaches could gameplan to take away one player in a knockout situation. It was a major flaw in how our team was designed.
I well remember being one of the loudest shrieking voices pointing out the team's lack of a second scorer after the playoff loss last year. But again, since people keep giving me an excuse for more reminders of how bad it has been:
- In 4 elimination contests under PV the team never once held a lead;
- They never held a tie beyond the opening 0-0;
- They never scored the first goal; and
- They never scored the second goal.
This was not a turnaround job, where you hire a competent but middling safe choice mid-season to right a sinking ship, and he stays maybe 1.5 seasons, and you don't renew his contract and turn it over to someone more ambitious. He was not hired to improve the club for the next guy. He was the next guy. PV has pedigree, he's ambitious, and if he goes he is leaving us on his terms in mid-season. He can go, but he deserves no slack for or sugarcoating of his results here.
One potential achievement will be left open to him even if he leaves. If we win the CCL spot after he leaves this week I figure he gets about 65% of the credit. We're currently about 69% through the combined seasons, and we're in second place -- slightly -- by PPG so I round down a bit. But he still will deserve the major share of the credit should it play out that way.
See, the pleading orphan and parenticide.
Last edited:
PV has done a lot for us, but I think 2nd place is as high as we'll get while he's here.
I will say this about Vieira. There are a lot of teams in this league that play a boring brand of soccer, and we're not one of them. I hope we never have the look of a Revolution, or a Colorado, or a Real Salt Lake. Not just inferior players, but inferior systems. We should credit Vieira for finding a system that's fun to watch while also being relatively successful.
I'm not sure if our failures in cup games or in big games is on PV, the players, or a mixture of both. But I do think our failures in the playoffs and the derbies is why I'm less upset about Vieira leaving than had we been legitimately close to winning a trophy in the last few years.
I guess I am more concerned about all the games rather than four of the games. PV was pivotal to our elevation to the top tier of MLS. I wouldn't be jumping for joy right now.
PV elevated us, but he also was pigheaded with his insistence to leave guys off the 18 during when “starters” were exhausted/not being rotated and/or Mikey Lopez was playing. Those choices cost us points. It’s one thing not to play a player who is holding out and not practicing, like New England did with Lee Nguyen, but to banish guys that are practicing and have needed skill sets, like Mix and Lewis, is just small-minded and limits the club’s potential success.
Similar threads
