Atlanta - Postmatch - Eastern Conference Semifinals Leg 1

[Marito]

BTW, how terrible is MLSsoccer website, the Mata chance, which was our clearer chance all game, is not in their highlights (neither our disallowed goal) and all their "analysts" seem to have forgotten it, and claim we only had half-chances. Mata's was a xG .8 chance or close.

 

[Ulrich]

BTW, how terrible is MLSsoccer website, the Mata chance, which was our clearer chance all game, is not in their highlights (neither our disallowed goal) and all their "analysts" seem to have forgotten it, and claim we only had half-chances. Mata's was a xG .8 chance or close.

Narrative. There’s a very particular narrative when talking about Atlanta.

 

[Seven]

BTW, how terrible is MLSsoccer website, the Mata chance, which was our clearer chance all game, is not in their highlights (neither our disallowed goal) and all their "analysts" seem to have forgotten it, and claim we only had half-chances. Mata's was a xG .8 chance or close.

Wasn’t Mata offsides on that anyway?

 

[Marito]

I was at the stadium, so I cannot tell you without a replay. But I don't think so because part of the problem with his finishing (besides him being Mata) is that he was running into the pass, and the pass (backheel flip from Villa, I think) was completely vertical, so I'm guessing he ran past the defenders in the time it took them to turn. I guess.

 

[canchon]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1059483403689644034

Dome needs to pull a Jesse Marsch and start working the officials for the second leg.

 

[gbservis]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1059483403689644034

Dome needs to pull a Jesse Marsch and start working the officials for the second leg.

Maxi takes so many fouls that don't get called. Sometimes I think his ball skills are at such a higher level as compared to the rest of the league that the refs aren't capable of following his footwork and completely unprepared to make calls on such quick nuanced movements. It's a shame, another example of PRO refs falling behind in the improving skill of the league.

 

[Christopher Jee]

Maxi takes so many fouls that don't get called. Sometimes I think his ball skills are at such a higher level as compared to the rest of the league that the refs aren't capable of following his footwork and completely unprepared to make calls on such quick nuanced movements. It's a shame, another example of PRO refs falling behind in the improving skill of the league.

Yeah, at risk of hyperbole, but I almost wanna say he's world class in this department. A real pleasure to watch. If his final ball / last touch decision-making was on par he wouldn't be playing in MLS. I just hope some of his pixie magic rubs off on Medina, who may be the worst protector of the ball in the entire squad.

 

[LeeNYCFC]

Maxi takes so many fouls that don't get called. Sometimes I think his ball skills are at such a higher level as compared to the rest of the league that the refs aren't capable of following his footwork and completely unprepared to make calls on such quick nuanced movements. It's a shame, another example of PRO refs falling behind in the improving skill of the league.

This is probably tinfoil hat stuff on my part, but I tend to believe that refs overcompensate for Maxi's stature. They look at him and assume that it won't take much to knock him over, and swallow their whistle at times because of it. Watching him every week, he actually seems to me like someone who isn't interested in going down easily, but unfortunately as you say the refs seem convinced that they don't need to do more curtail the amount of fouls he draws. He's the third-most fouled player in the league according to WhoScored, and I still feel like he's not getting everything he deserves.

 

[mgarbowski]

I wouldn’t have an issue with the ref making that call against Villa if Martinez didn’t recklessly jump into him, leading with a hip, with no true intent to play the ball. His intent was completely to ruin Villa’s timing, and the result was crashing into him and landing on his back. He also was invading the space occupied by Villa, not challenging for the ball where two players are converging on unclaimed territory.

By calling the foul on Villa, the ref sets a precedent that all a defender has to do is move in the direction of the ball and make contact with the attacker attempting a bicycle kick - that’s not in the spirit of dangerous play as the defender also has to be cognizant of how his actions affect the play.

I at least half agree. I'm not sure about Martinez's intent: I think he just went in to disrupt - either by getting the ball or drawing a foul or whatever. And he seemed to change his mind half way through when he realized leading with his head was dangerous to his own safety and he twisted . But I completely agree the result is most generously described as clumsy.

I also tried to figure out who hit whom or what first among Martinez, Villa and the ball. I can't come up with a clear answer. I think the ref reverts to defaults, which in this case conflict. Usually, if there's contact and it's not clear who initiated it the offensive player gets the benefit. But, in potentially dangerous play, the one being potentially dangerous does not get the benefit. And I think that's how the ref went here. I'm also sympathetic to Warshaw's position that these are professionals and big boys and you let this go. I think he would flip if Villa actually kicked Martinez in the head, but he didn't, so play on.

 

[Ulrich]

I at least half agree. I'm not sure about Martinez's intent: I think he just went in to disrupt - either by getting the ball or drawing a foul or whatever. And he seemed to change his mind half way through when he realized leading with his head was dangerous to his own safety and he twisted . But I completely agree the result is most generously described as clumsy.

I also tried to figure out who hit whom or what first among Martinez, Villa and the ball. I can't come up with a clear answer. I think the ref reverts to defaults, which in this case conflict. Usually, if there's contact and it's not clear who initiated it the offensive player gets the benefit. But, in potentially dangerous play, the one being potentially dangerous does not get the benefit. And I think that's how the ref went here. I'm also sympathetic to Warshaw's position that these are professionals and big boys and you let this go. I think he would flip if Villa actually kicked Martinez in the head, but he didn't, so play on.

Villa made contact with the ball before Martinez hip checked him... the ball essentially went where it was supposed to (Villa didn’t make perfect contact) and if Martinez had a real shot at the ball, Villa’s foot wouldn’t have connected. That’s really how the ref should have looked at the play - Martinez was late in the challenge, and if held to the same standards as a slide tackle that was late, it’d have been on him for a PK and not attributable to Villa.

 

[canchon]

https://www.mlssoccer.com/post/2018...fside-tying-goal-instant-replay?autoplay=true

Ugh. Although Warshaw said that the NYCFC goal should have counted. Yet another goal/PK where afterwards the review is “yeah, it’s the wrong call.”

 

[LionNYC]

I really don't like Dome's press conferences. Never calls out the opponents or the referees. Just repeats the same "just win" thing over and over again.

 

[ZYanksRule]

I really don't like Dome's press conferences. Never calls out the opponents or the referees. Just repeats the same "just win" thing over and over again.

MLS fines the coaches if they even sniff taking a crack at the refs. It's really not worth the fine. I care far more about what he says in the locker room than what he says to the media.

 

[LionNYC]

MLS fines the coaches if they even sniff taking a crack at the refs. It's really not worth the fine. I care far more about what he says in the locker room than what he says to the media.

I've told him on multiple occasions that I'd pay his fines for talking about the referees. There isn't a problem unless you acknowledge there is a problem.

 

[Seven]

It’s so disappointing that for the third straight year, it feels like our playoffs are over before the second leg has even started. And I know 1-0 is not an insurmountable lead, but it just feels like this is too tall of a task against a team like Atlanta who feasts on teams on the counter, and away at Atlanta.

 

[JayH]

It’s so disappointing that for the third straight year, it feels like our playoffs are over before the second leg has even started. And I know 1-0 is not an insurmountable lead, but it just feels like this is too tall of a task against a team like Atlanta who feasts on teams on the counter, and away at Atlanta.

But if it were last year or the year before, Martinez would have scored on one or both of those great chances in stoppage time to turn next week from tall task to insurmountable. It was nice to see the effort by SJ and defensively until the final whistle to preserve some hope. At least there's the glimmer.

 

[NYCFCfan]

I felt a bit of hope coming into this match, I don't really have that hope for the next match.

I can't help but wonder what Jonathan Lewis could have achieved instead of Matarrita on the left wing. While I'm a fan of Mata on defense, I can't really buy into him playing up top or in this weird left wingback role.

 

[mgarbowski]

But if it were last year or the year before, Martinez would have scored on one or both of those great chances in stoppage time to turn next week from tall task to insurmountable. It was nice to see the effort by SJ and defensively until the final whistle to preserve some hope. At least there's the glimmer.

Agreed. Around minute 80 I said something in the shoutbox to the effect of this is where we concede the killer goal to destroy all hope. It didn't happen. Atlanta had chances but Chanot was a fucking monster on their breakaways and counters.
I'm not especially optimistic still, because Atlanta destroys teams at home once the opponent needs to start chasing goals, and we need to chase a goal, and we were bad on the road all year, and won only 1 away game against a playoff team way back in Week 1, and Atlanta thoroughly outclassed us for 45+ minutes of the first half before they took out Almiron and started game management. So there is no reason to think we have it in us to do anything.

But, the other side is we played mostly the same 11 guys in 3 high stakes games in 8 days. Now we get a week off. We played with or better than Atlanta in the Spring. We can do it. I don't know if Torrent can unlock it, but the ability is in there. And I can convince myself that I'd at least rather watch our guys chase Atlanta than just try to game manage for 90 minutes in that madhouse and hold on to a 1 or 2 goal lead. Finally, the Away goal doesn't matter really, except as a goal. Nothing matters unless we score at least once, in which case the away goals are already tied, and anything we score above that puts us ahead in away goals. The only difference between this and a 0-0 result followed by an Atlanta goal in the first minute of Leg 2 is under that scenario, if we finish 1-1 NYC wins, where now it goes to Extra Time. That's the only scenario where the away goal is relevant contrasted to an ATL home goal.

 

[JayH]

But, the other side is we played mostly the same 11 guys in 3 high stakes games in 8 days. Now we get a week off. We played with or better than Atlanta in the Spring. We can do it. I don't know if Torrent can unlock it, but the ability is in there. And I can convince myself that I'd at least rather watch our guys chase Atlanta than just try to game manage for 90 minutes in that madhouse and hold on to a 1 or 2 goal lead. Finally, the Away goal doesn't matter really, except as a goal. Nothing matters unless we score at least once, in which case the away goals are already tied, and anything we score above that puts us ahead in away goals. The only difference between this and a 0-0 result followed by an Atlanta goal in the first minute of Leg 2 is under that scenario, if we finish 1-1 NYC wins, where now it goes to Extra Time. That's the only scenario where the away goal is relevant contrasted to an ATL home goal.

I agree with all of this. As for ^, this is exactly where I am at. It's set up so all we have to do is win one game to advance. It's essentially another knockout game, but on the road. A damn tough one, against a damn tough team, in a damn tough place. But if we don't have the swagger (or the talent and/or the coaching) to accomplish that, we shouldn't be contending for the Cup and will finish exactly where we should finish. Frankly, I don't love our chances - but if we lose, I will be ok with the idea that we got exactly what we deserved.

The separate conversation would then be what we need to do to put ourselves in a better position next season, but that's what the 2019 Roster Discussion thread is for.

I'm using my "one time" for this one.

 

[mgarbowski]

I agree with all of this. As for ^, this is exactly where I am at. It's set up so all we have to do is win one game to advance. It's essentially another knockout game, but on the road. A damn tough one, against a damn tough team, in a damn tough place. But if we don't have the swagger (or the talent and/or the coaching) to accomplish that, we shouldn't be contending for the Cup and will finish exactly where we should finish. Frankly, I don't love our chances - but if we lose, I will be ok with the idea that we got exactly what we deserved.

The separate conversation would then be what we need to do to put ourselves in a better position next season, but that's what the 2019 Roster Discussion thread is for.

I'm using my "one time" for this one.

Win a road playoff game. Third time is the charm.