I understand the young guys with sell on potential strategy but wish we could once in awhile still go after someone like Benteke or Giroud for them to learn from .
MLS - May 18 - Red Bulls (Home - CF)
- Thread starter LionNYC
- Start date
If Jovan, Julian, Hannes, and Agustin are part of a team that wins MLS Cup (or seriously challenges) in the next 2-3 years, it will have been the right decision. Rushing the rebuild could have set us back even more -- I'm OK with being patient, building it properly, and creating a core of players who will be here for the next 4 years and lead us to our next star.
We have those guys though -- Maxi and Hannes are both experienced players in the attack.
I completely understand why we want the excitement of a big-name player, but we've also seen those signings don't work as often as you'd expect. Look at DC with Benteke, or Galaxy with Zlatan ...
You need to have the right guys around them . You can’t just have the big name and bunch of bums . If we had one of those guys at 9 to reliably finish off the chances created we’d be unbelievably good right now instead of just good .
There is no such thing as rushing a rebuild in the MLS. Teams miss the playoffs and win the cup the next season. Atlanta won a cup the 2nd season after the team was created. LAFC won the supporter's shield and set the record for most points in a season in their second season of existence. No team in MLS history has won based on a multi-year rebuild that started with a bunch of super-expensive 18-year-olds. Slow rebuilds happen in other US sports because there is value in daft picks and rookie contracts. None of that matters in the MLS. The only rebuild justification you could have is that players need time to get used to playing with each other but even then the spine of our team Martins, Sands, Gray, Otoole, Parks, and Santi already have years of playing time together.
What are the benefits of a slow rebuild in MLS given the current salary cap rules and roster mechanisms? What teams have undergone 3-4 year development processes as a road map to MLS success? This whole rebuild thing is just unsupported narrative concepts being applied from other sports to justify CFGs actions with a nice-sounding story.
That's a very fair point. I do wonder if we are at the forefront of what this league is becoming. Maybe we're an extreme case, but this is becoming a selling league. It's becoming a developmental league for young players - that's the next progression of how MLS takes a step towards where it wants to go. Maybe we're on the extreme side and should have gone with guys in the 21-22 range instead of 18-19, or maybe Jovan and Agu will be the bedrocks of the next team to win a championship.
My goal for this season is to be top-4 in the East, get 2 of 3 at home in that three-game series first-round, then see what we can do in the conference semifinals. If we do that, we'll be building towards another star.
Yeah, it's possible, if Lee turns out to be a visionary and this is the foundation of a long run of success I will be happy to eat my words. I'm not opposed to stocking a solid portion of the roster with prospects but spending the entire off-season transfer budget on 18-year-olds was a bit extreme IMO.
Twellman's discussion of xG at halftime was one of the dumbest sports announcing sequences I've ever heard.
i was surprised to hear twellman's voice. I wasn't expecting him to announce our game. I thought he almost always had dibs on miami games.
He sounded a bit disinterested in our game to be honest. Didn't seem like the usual Twellman hot takes commentary. Maybe he was struggling to find something to talk about haha.
I skipped halftime and threw something else on the tv cause I have no patience but if it was anti XG I’m in his side .
Couldn't watch this live but I watched the replay in spite of knowing the results because derby.
I was thinking I would have been pretty anxious throughout the second half if I didn't already know the outcome, but reactions here and the stats on the MLS site aren't really backing me up (xG and shots/SOG in particular). Felt like we were under a lot of pressure.
Anyway, not trying to complain about a derby win or 9 points from 3 rivalry games or 6 wins in 7 matches. Maybe my brain hasn't caught up to material conditions.
I was thinking I would have been pretty anxious throughout the second half if I didn't already know the outcome, but reactions here and the stats on the MLS site aren't really backing me up (xG and shots/SOG in particular). Felt like we were under a lot of pressure.
Anyway, not trying to complain about a derby win or 9 points from 3 rivalry games or 6 wins in 7 matches. Maybe my brain hasn't caught up to material conditions.
Well, it is Twellman. Why wasn’t he announcing his home team Messiami?
Also is there video of this anywhere? lol
in addition to what happened during game play, in the last week we saw:
-a Toronto FC player get involved in a brawl in a game he didn’t even suit up for
-multiple headbutts and kicks to the groin between opposing players in said brawl
-a coach accusing the NYCFC coach of punching a teenager two months ago
-a raccoon having one of the best animal on the field runs in MLS history
-NYCFC subsequently adopting the raccoon as its new mascot
-a major crowd control miss enabling tons of fans to be late to the game
-the home tailgate being moved because of a dead body
Yeah. We are nothing if not interesting. What a week.
-a Toronto FC player get involved in a brawl in a game he didn’t even suit up for
-multiple headbutts and kicks to the groin between opposing players in said brawl
-a coach accusing the NYCFC coach of punching a teenager two months ago
-a raccoon having one of the best animal on the field runs in MLS history
-NYCFC subsequently adopting the raccoon as its new mascot
-a major crowd control miss enabling tons of fans to be late to the game
-the home tailgate being moved because of a dead body
Yeah. We are nothing if not interesting. What a week.
He's been that far forward the last few games. The previous two he didn't start there, but moved there following subs (Parks in at Toronto and Haak in at Philly).
It's been very interesting and something I'm hoping to ask Cushing about this week (wanted to ask him Saturday night but wasn't given a question).
Probably recency bias, but it's definitely up there.
If we're talking best derby ever based on NYCFC performance alone, probably the 5-2 win in 2020. But lopsided games, while great, aren't as thrilling and exciting and that one was also with a muted crowd due to COVID.
In terms of thrilling, the Villa hat trick, Heber meg, and 1-1 draw down 2 men definitely come to mind.
Yeah I'm not sure this is even in the Top 5.
Villa, Heber, 9-man game are clearly ahead. The first win with Villa and Harrison scoring is ahead, too. Sweeping them in 2022 with the Santi opener is ahead.
It's at halftime of the full game replay, but in short he opened with the "xG says [___] but I know what I saw" gambit, which fine, but xG is based on detailed tracking of millions of shots over many years based on at least
- location
- kick, volley, header, etc.
- state of play (free kick, breakaway, standard run of play etc)
- location of defenders
xG has limitations. It doesn't capture everything (eg if a team gets the ball to players in dangerous positions and they fail to shoot) but what it captures it does very well. Most of the complaints about it are based on it not sufficiently corresponding to actual goals over small samples, which is like complaining that a .300 hitter went 0 for 6 in yesterday's game, so what's the point of Batting Average anyway, or that same player hit .310, .270 and .320 in consecutive seasons.
To give Twellman some slack, he was reacting to the MLS xG figures which continue to be crazy outliers. For the full game, ASA had NYC with 0.02 more xG than RB. Opta had NYC up by 0.11. MLS had NYC up by 1.20. I don't trust the MLS xG figures at all.
For a somewhat fuller sense of each teams chances: according to Opta, NYC had 3 of the 4 most dangerous shots in the game, the 2 goals plus Jovan's from just inside the spot. Both teams had 7 shots worth at least 0.05 xG. RB had more <5% shots by 8 to 5, and one of them went in.
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