2017 Roster Discussion

[JayH]

I don't deny we need help in the back, but give Brillant and Chanot more time to gel and they'll be fine. Yes to a RB though.

Where we really need more help in the midfield with two new guys that run non-stop, win balls, and have the ability to control the ball. Far too often we were overrun in the midfield this year. I think that's entirely attributed to our guys being older/slower - we need serious youth/skill there.

Yup, this. First, spend a bit more money than you would spend on guys like Ethan White and Jason Hernandez who don't fit the system (in fact, any system) to get one or two outside backs who can stop, cover and pass. Give Brillant and Chanot a chance to be at least a passable tandem. Maybe move Mata up because he can run wide through the MF and he surely can't play defense. Maybe drop Harrison back and try to mold him into a MF who can run and control. And find one younger, faster QB for the MF (DP?) who can link the front and back. We then control games. And playing out of the back becomes more efficient and less scary.

Unfortunately What Lamps and Pirlo do could stall/derail such plans.

 

[Tom in Fairfield CT]

Unfortunately What Lamps and Pirlo do could stall/derail such plans.

Everything is predicated on Pirlo. If he stays, you again have to mold the entire team to suit him. And if he gets injured/ has an off night like in these playoffs, you don't stand a chance.

So in my opinion, we can't make any comments on 2017 unless you clarify with pirlo or without.

 

[canchon]

I think the 3 DPs in MLS are best used when you have one creating, one finishing, and one destroying.

Giovinco creates, Altidore finishes, Bradley destroys. Showed us how it's done.

 

[ktdNYCFC]

Everything is predicated on Pirlo. If he stays, you again have to mold the entire team to suit him. And if he gets injured/ has an off night like in these playoffs, you don't stand a chance.

So in my opinion, we can't make any comments on 2017 unless you clarify with pirlo or without.

Pirlo out, Yaya in?

 

[gbservis]

Everything is predicated on Pirlo. If he stays, you again have to mold the entire team to suit him. And if he gets injured/ has an off night like in these playoffs, you don't stand a chance.

So in my opinion, we can't make any comments on 2017 unless you clarify with pirlo or without.

Yes, but some of the pieces you need to succeed with Pirlo notably athletic box to box mids to protect him are also valuable components needed on any successful MLS team.

Giovinco creates, Altidore finishes, Bradley destroys. Showed us how it's done.

I agree we need a destroyer in the midfield. It's interesting that in some ways one of the biggest pieces we are missing is a young version of our coach. I've often wondered if PV ever wishes he had a player similar to himself in games like the one last night as he's forced to watch our mids get completely over run.

 

[canchon]

Several thoughts on offseason moves:

1. I don't think Lampard will be back. If he comes back I would try to do it on these terms: 1) a more cap-friendly contract - but honestly I don't think he will be back for anything less than DP money - and 2) start molding Frank into a second striker. He can't run with the MF anymore and his late runs are what are still valuable. His health is also a big question.

2. I'm not sure what Pirlo will do. As many have said, he looked awful last night (even had a moment where he just got crushed). I'm a big Pirlo fan but honestly think he is a luxury player for how MLS plays and you need to build the team around him. At this point I would move on. He also faded as the season went on.

3. I'm also not sure I want Iraola back to be our CDM - while he made a good transition it seemed as the season went on that he lost sharpness, and also didn't play well under pressure. He was almost needed as a 3rd CB at times. So I'm not sure if it is tactical. I don't think he is still under contract.

4. I think Brillant and Chanot could be a good tandem and should be given more time. One well-known MLS Analyst said that NYCFC needs to get "MLS-quality centerbacks" and I'm not sure what that is. Does he mean big physical guys who lump the ball? Chanot is quality in terms of possession and Brilliant just needs to clean up the howlers. Also not sure what you do with Mena - he's got great physical tools but a 10 cent head. Not sure if you can fix that.

5. Keep Matarrita and have him work on defending or move him up to wing. He's got talent and it needs to be exploited. On the other side, not sure if RJ Allen is the answer, he seemed to fade as the season went on.

6. Obviously you keep Tommy Mac, Harrison, Shelton...young (and cheap guys) with upside. Figure out what Tommy Mac's role is, I don't think he's a winger in the 4-3-3.

7. Bravo is also young, can definitely destroy, but needs to improve his ball skills. Can he take a step forward and be a poor man's Alonso? Also he is on loan does he want to stay?

8. Obviously you keep Villa - but not sure if he plays as a single striker. He doesn't provide the hold-up play and could potentially benefit by playing off someone.

9. You have to go with Lurch as your starter - so find a way to offload Saunders. I don't think you protect both of them in the expansion draft. Maybe that is how Saunders goes.

10. I'm assuming Mix is bought out or somehow traded/sold. No further comment on that.

11. I know PV is high on Mendoza but I'm not sure that he stays as well. I think he's on loan, plus he seems to not have a big soccer brain.

Seems like a lot of holes (outside back/DM/creative midfielder/second striker)...but good news they could have up to 2 DP slots available and Mix off the books, plus might get CCL allocation money if Seattle doesn't win MLS Cup. Lots to do this offseason.

 

[Ulrich]

Yes, but some of the pieces you need to succeed with Pirlo notably athletic box to box mids to protect him are also valuable components needed on any successful MLS team.



I agree we need a destroyer in the midfield. It's interesting that in some ways one of the biggest pieces we are missing is a young version of our coach. I've often wondered if PV ever wishes he had a player similar to himself in games like the one last night as he's forced to watch our mids get completely over run.

It was tough last night watching Iraola drop to sweeper at times. Without him solid in the midfield, we just didn't have an extra outlet since Frank isn't a phenomenal dribbler and Pirlo can only hold off two defenders at most.

 

[Fantazma]

it will be telling how they approach the offseason....i really am going to be pissed if lampard gets an extension.

we will see now if they want names only or want to improve the team.

still think we need to figure out GK, also need RB and CDM as mentioned everywhere...also need a CM.

well also see who we lose in expansion draft...and whats gonna happen with Mix.

 

[LionNYC]

Mix Diskerud will be the most interesting story in this offseason. From my understanding, he has the perfect player's contract. No waive, no trade, guaranteed. He signed for 4 years meaning he's on our books for the next 2 years at his current salary.

I don't know if he has to be protected in the expansion draft, but if doesn't want to be moved to another team he has the right to say no. If we want to buy him out it would be a multi-million dollar buyout with a buyout clause bonus (or something) that wouldn't count against the cap, but is that in the best financial decision for the club?

He enjoys New York but isn't allowed, by Vieira, to play here.

This is going to be fun, sad, exciting, depressing, and interesting to watch.

 

[gbservis]

Mix Diskerud will be the most interesting story in this offseason. From my understanding, he has the perfect player's contract. No waive, no trade, guaranteed. He signed for 4 years meaning he's on our books for the next 2 years at his current salary.

I don't know if he has to be protected in the expansion draft, but if doesn't want to be moved to another team he has the right to say no. If we want to buy him out it would be a multi-million dollar buyout with a buyout clause bonus (or something) that wouldn't count against the cap, but is that in the best financial decision for the club?

He enjoys New York but isn't allowed, by Vieira, to play here.

This is going to be fun, sad, exciting, depressing, and interesting to watch.

I think in past expansion drafts any player that has a no-trade clause automatically has to be on your protected list. I agree, how this plays out will be very interesting.

 

[sbrylski]

I wonder if a 5-2-3 with inverted fullbacks is on the table. In a flash, we could overload the midfield with the fullbacks, sweeper, or wingers filling in.

Say we grab a DP center mid, retain Pirlo, and sign Ventura Alvarado and that Irish winger Daryl Horgan:

Horgan, Villa, Harrison
Pirlo, DP
Matarrita, Brillant, Chanot, Alvarado, Allen

Defensive, flexible, with a quick hitting attack.

 

[Ulrich]

I think in past expansion drafts any player that has a no-trade clause automatically has to be on your protected list. I agree, how this plays out will be very interesting.

Is it possible with his contract he can also veto a buyout? I doubt Mix would want to be personna non grata for 2 more years, but could he tell them, no, you're not buying me out because you've effectively screwed my chances at landing another good team by being benched, so either play me or pay me to practice?

 

[adam]

So our roster from a Salary Cap perspective looks like this. I highlighted the players I'm assuming are gone. I left Pirlo off that list, since it's not a given. We'll save about $2mm in cap space by releasing these players, be 3 players short of a full roster, but only about $500,000 under the cap. However there is no reason not to think we use TAM & GAM to go above the cap like we've done the previous two year. Especially if we're given extra GAM for CCL qualification.



* Chanot's salary is assumed based on his listed $380k being prorated for half a season. It's so high because NYCFCfan let us know we had to pay a $600,000 transfer fee, which we don't know how many years it's pr0rated over ( 3=$200k, 4=$150k) and added to the listed salary.
** I don't know if Norris Ethan White qualifies as a HG anymore, but it doesn't matter, he's most probably gone.

After the cuts in red.

 

[JayH]

Is it possible with his contract he can also veto a buyout? I doubt Mix would want to be personna non grata for 2 more years, but could he tell them, no, you're not buying me out because you've effectively screwed my chances at landing another good team by being benched, so either play me or pay me to practice?

I suspect that a mutually agreed-upon plan for his departure is already in place.

 

[NYCFCfan]

Also, FYI, Matarrita has 2 more years left on his deal with another year as a club option.

 

[JGarrettLieb]

Is it possible with his contract he can also veto a buyout? I doubt Mix would want to be personna non grata for 2 more years, but could he tell them, no, you're not buying me out because you've effectively screwed my chances at landing another good team by being benched, so either play me or pay me to practice?

A buyout would be the best financial decision he can make. He would get all or most of the money he would have otherwise received for the next two years and be able to compete as a first team player elsewhere. His soccer would improve and he'd be making money on top of what he would have made.

I do think he's in the 500k range in terms of skill vs salary, it's just he needs to be on the right team, which we aren't.

 

[LionNYC]

Hot Take: Andoni Iraola retires this offseason

 

[LionNYC]

Monday, December 12 is when Expansion Draft Protected Player list comes out. So by that point we should know who on our roster is staying and going.

I expect after that date for new player signings to be announced. Why waste a spot on someone new?

 

[Ulrich]

A buyout would be the best financial decision he can make. He would get all or most of the money he would have otherwise received for the next two years and be able to compete as a first team player elsewhere. His soccer would improve and he'd be making money on top of what he would have made.

I do think he's in the 500k range in terms of skill vs salary, it's just he needs to be on the right team, which we aren't.

I don't disagree. I'm just wondering if Mix is a bit spiteful of the way he's been treated - he's been a company man 100% while being dissed pretty badly. Even the best & most level-headed psyches are subject to spiteful thoughts when treated poorly. He was treated even worse than Ballouchy who at least made the bench at the end of the season (once?).

The gist of my initial post/pondering was a big what if, because if it's in his power to stay, how crazy would it be if he exercised that forcing the team to figure out how best to use him and voila, we actually play well next year with him and a few new bodies???? I know, I know, not going to happen, but it's the off season and this is exactly what the offseason is for - nonsense speculation.

 

[Kjbert]

What I know (told by a member of the organization):
- The team has offered Frank the option to come back. The expectation is that he is retiring and going home.
- Mix Diskerud will never suit up for NYCFC in a competitive match again, short of the team being sold to a different ownership group.

What I think I know (based on the same conversation):
- Diskerud will be left unprotected in the Expansion Draft.
- None of the current loanees will be purchased.
- Tommy McNamara could be used as trade bait to improve the team.
- The organization views Jack Harrison as a Central Midfielder. This year, they didn't believe they had the appropriate amount of depth out wide to give him quality minutes centrally.
- There are still some personality issues on this team that they hope to rid themselves of in the offseason.